[Avodah] Be among the talmidim of Aharon

via Avodah avodah at lists.aishdas.org
Mon Jul 6 17:12:31 PDT 2015


From: Lisa Liel via Avodah  <avodah at lists.aishdas.org>

The sheer vitriol I've seen from  Orthodox Jews over the past days since
the Supreme Court decision making  same-sex civil marriage the law of
the land in the United States has been  overwhelming.  And I just don't
get it.  And it's part and parcel  of the viciousness I've seen from so
many otherwise loving frum Jews over the  years when it comes to  this


I have seen none of that "vitriol" or "viciousness," either in the past few 
 days or in the last few years, or ever.  On the contrary, all I see is an  
almost desperate attempt to be conciliatory, a desperate if hopeless wish 
not to  be the *victims* of liberal, anti-religious vitriol.  
See for example "A Letter by Reb Ahron Feldman to a Gay Baal Teshuva"
Also see Agudath Israel's statement on the recent Supreme Court  
gay-marriage decision
It reads, in part, "we are deeply concerned that, as a result of today’s  
ruling, and as the dissenting Justices have pointed out, members and  
institutions of traditional communities like the Orthodox Jewish community we  
represent may incur moral opprobrium and risk tangible negative consequence if  
they refuse to transgress their beliefs, and even if they simply teach and  
express their religious views publicly." 
I might add that Lisa's post, being an emotional cri de coeur, really 
belongs on Areivim.  However,  since she has posted it to Avodah, I will add my 
own comments previously posted  on Cross-Currents:
Here, for the record, is what our ancient Torah heritage has to say about  
homosexual marriage: 
The nations are allowed to continue in existence only because they keep a  
minimum of three mitzvos. These are: not writing marriage documents for the  
union of two males, not selling human flesh in the market place, and giving 
 honor to the Torah—which in practice means, not persecuting the people of 
the  Torah, the Jewish people. 
In one of his prophetic visions, the Navi (prophet) Zechariah took thirty  
pieces of silver and threw them into the Temple treasury in Jerusalem 
(Zechariah  11:13). The Rabbis of the Talmud had varying interpretations of what 
this vision  symbolized. According to Rabbi Ulla (Talmud Chullin 92B), the 
thirty pieces of  silver symbolized the thirty mitzvos that the Bnei Noach 
accepted upon  themselves. These thirty mitzvos include not worshipping idols, 
not consulting  witchcraft and sorcery, refraining from illicit sexual 
relationships, and so on.  (Bnei Noach are the Sons of Noah, also called Noahides—
i.e., the nations of the  world.) 
Rabbi Ulla says that the world continues to exist because the nations  
accepted these thirty mitzvos. However, he adds, the nations do not keep all the 
 mitzvos they accepted. They keep only three, and one of the three is: “
They do  not write a marriage contract for males.” Rashi comments that the 
nations do  engage in forbidden homosexual relations, but they at least 
acknowledge that  such relations are illicit by not formalizing those relations in 
legal  documents. 
The other two commandments that they keep are that they do not sell human  
flesh in the market place, and that they give honor to the Torah (Talmud 
Chullin  92B). 
Elsewhere the Rabbis of old stated that the final decree of destruction, 
the  Great Flood, was sealed against the generation of Noach because they 
wrote  marriage documents for males. “Rabbi Huna said in the name of Rabbi 
Yosef, ‘The  generation of the Flood was not wiped out until they wrote marriage 
documents  for the union of a man to a male or to an animal ’ ” (Genesis 
Rabbah 26:5;  Leviticus Rabbah 23:9). 
Implicit is the assumption that if the nations do not abide by at least the 
 aforementioned three mitzvos, they may forfeit the very right to exist. 
Hence,  these three—not writing marriage documents for males, not selling 
human flesh in  the marketplace, and honoring the Torah—may be considered the 
Three Conditions  for the continued existence of mankind. 
So you see, the idea of gay marriage is not new, not a fresh idea that  
represents the ultimate development, enlightenment and evolution of mankind. 
No,  the formal marriage of two men is a very ancient idea that represents the 
 degradation of mankind. 
I will add a further point to what I wrote in 2011: 
The reason the gay pride movement adopted rainbow colors as their symbol is 
 that the rainbow is the sign of Hashem’s promise not to wipe out the 
entire  world again in one big flood. They wave the rainbow flag in defiance of 
Him, as  if to say, “Ha ha, You can’t touch us!” The message of the rainbow 
flag is, “We  are major sinners, like the generation of the Flood.” But 
they are whistling in  the dark if they think there won’t be consequences. May 
Hashem protect His  people, those who are chassidei umos ha’olam as well as 
us, Klal Yisrael. 

Read  more: 

--Toby  Katz
t613k at aol.com


-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.aishdas.org/pipermail/avodah-aishdas.org/attachments/20150706/4aac9f01/attachment-0008.html>

More information about the Avodah mailing list