[Avodah] Shituf

Lisa Liel lisa at starways.net
Wed Jan 9 15:52:51 PST 2013

On 1/9/2013 3:24 PM, Meir Shinnar wrote:
> 1) the rites are not the 4 that are assur regardless of intent&  nature of worship
> 2) why is she doing the rites? Not that she is trying to worship Jesus, but to enable them to fulfill their worship ( eg, someone needed to pour water, anoint - which have no az significance outside  of what we give them -  or say some texts) .what makes the actions assur? The intent,&  there is no intent of avoda Zara - but to merely enable the nonJew to keep his worship....
According to all the Rishonim except possibly the Meiri, his worship is 
avodah zarah.  Enabling the non-Jew to violate that is wrong.

> Similarly with the text - is it assur without kavanah? Are Jewish musicians forbidden to sIng a Bach cantata ( or mass)

Absolutely, if it's Christian liturgy.  Same with Christmas carols.  Are 
you suggesting there's any situation in the world that would make it 
permissible for a Jew to sing Silent Night?  If you defecate in front of 
Baal Peor even as an insult, you've committed avodah zarah, because 
that's derekh avodato.  How would this be different?

> in a concert performance? What about professional singers working in a church?
The thing about kabbalat ol malchut shamayim is that there are things 
that are denied us.  We don't take jobs that require us to work on 
Shabbat.  We don't sing prayers to avodah zarah.

> At a certain point, one can argue that one has crossed the line - but it is a subtle issue. As many today view Christianity as clear az, the line seems far clearer to them...
Indeed.  I don't see the subtlety here.


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