[Avodah] An old Pshat and a Question About Milchig on Shavuos

[Micha Berger]

On Fri, Jun 13, 2008 at 02:03:39AM -0400, Samuel Svarc wrote:
: Why would you think otherwise? Besides for all the places where it says that
: they did actually disobey or could (fruit trees, by kol nidrei, etc.), what
: is the sevara not that way? AFAIK, only that the malachs knowledge is on a
: much clearer level, but this doesn't preclude them from choosing to disobey.

The Or Samei'ach says it does. RYGB suggested that perhaps the OS is
only talking bout a mal'akh while in shamayim and that once it's on
shelichus in olam hazeh, it can make wrong choices. Rav Moshe writes
similarly in Derash Moshe (Vayeira).

The Rambam, OTOH, says that even in potential, mal'akhim lack bechirah.
I think the Seforno says it as well on Ber 1:26.

This is discussed at length in the Or Samayach's essay /detour in Hil
Teshuvah title "HaKol Tzafui vehaReshus Nesunah". (As is the question
of bechirah and Hashem's omniscience. A gold mine.) I think he also
discusses it in the Meshekh Chokhmah on Yisro.

There are also discussions amongst the rishonim on Shabbos 88b (where
the mal'akhim want to keep the Torah for themselves, and complain about
that interloper Moshe there to take it).

:-)BBii!
-Micha

-- 
Micha Berger             The trick is learning to be passionate in one's
micha at aishdas.org        ideals, but compassionate to one's peers.
http://www.aishdas.org
Fax: (270) 514-1507