[Avodah] is mayim acharonim a chumra?

[Shlomo Pick]

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Michael Poppers 
  To: avodah aishdas list 
  Cc: Shlomo Pick 
  Sent: Thursday, April 30, 2009 8:18 AM
  Subject: Re: is mayim acharonim a chumra?


  In Avodah Digest V26#73, RSP noted:
  > In OH, 181:1 the mechaber states emphatically that mayim achronim is an obligation....Chaza"l even pegged it to a verse in these parshot of vayikra, that one should be holy, this is mayim acharonim. At the end of this chapter, in no.10 the mechaber says that there are some who do not practice (she'ein nohagim) to wash mayim achronim, with the tosophot in berachot brought as the source. <
  The Tur says what RSP noted, and, after quoting Tos'fos, he writes at the end of the siman, "V'ham'vareich nami [isn't noheig to wash mayim acharonim --MP], kivan she'ein anu osin k'mo she'amar hapasuq 'ki qadosh Ani'-zeh shemen areiv, gam bin'tilah lo nahagu. V'lo miqri l'didan 'yadayim m'zuhamos' kivan she'ein anu r'gilin litol v'ein anu maqpidim b'kach...." In other words, the argument would be that not only, as per Tos'fos, is melach S'domis not found nowadays (going back to y'mei Tos'fos, many hundreds of years ago), but also our practices contradict important aspects of the d'rashah and of the concept of zuhama: (a) we're not fully following the d'rash of "v'hisqadishtem" re using shemen, and that d'rash isn't halfway, so it apparently doesn't apply l'halacha; and (b) since we're not particular to always wash our supposedly m'zuhamos hands after eating, we apparently don't have the condition which would mandate mayim acharonim in order to remove zuhama. (Re point (a), BTW, the counterpoint of BY 181:1 is worth the price of admission!)
  on point A, the tur implies (based on the tosaphot in hullin 105a and more upon the rosh at the end of the 8th chapter of berachot, that since shemen is not practiced it implies that the drasha is an asmachta, and also the custom (in northern germany and France) was not to wash mayim acharonim. that's all the tur says. i presume you would translate: and thus also the custom was not to... (and note the BY at the beginning of the siman as you have done).  point taken in the Tur, but i will note that the tur says nohagu and not nohagim. it may be just a copy of the tosophot, or it may be a reference to the past and not the present.

  i would point out here, that if anyone washes his hand after the meal for whatever reason, especially if he feels that his hands are greasy, then tur and the mechaber all state that he is obligated in mayim acharonim. thus anyone who washes his hands after a jelly sandwich, or herring, etc. would be obligated in mayim acharonim before benching.

  > Interestingly, the remah says nothing in either place, seemingly agreeing to the mechaber's view. <
  DM 181:1 is crystal clear: "Mihu haminhag k'divrei haTos'fos [sheheivi Rabbeinu b'sof hasiman -- Chidushei Hagahos]." As RRW has pointed out in the past, you really need to check out Tur SA -- SA is really an extract of BY and DM on Tur SA. I can't speak to why no extract (much less a quote) of RMA's words is in SA 181, but he certainly did write upon the subject. 

  oh, i know what the darkei moshe wrote, and is found at the end of the darkei moshe ha'aruch on the siman.  but just as he reacted to the BY in the darchei moshe and explicity stated that the minhag is like tosophot, why didn't he do that in the SA?  and that brings us to the issue of retraction. is his silence a retraction or not?

  > Finally the great forerunner of all minhag ashkenaz, the maharil, also obligated mayim acharonim, see spitzer ed., p. 117, no. 41, and especially note heh. <
  Could I bother you to quote the phraseology verbatim? Online, the words of the Lublin 1590 edition (http://hebrewbooks.org/11762 -- see pp.160-161) don't tell me anything about a mandate for mayim acharonim but rather seem to relate to explaining an "over la'asiyasan" question brought by Tos'fos. Thanks. 
  see further post with attachment

  shlomo
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