[Avodah] O attend R wedding = kosher eidim?

Michael Makovi mikewinddale at gmail.com
Wed Mar 12 06:28:23 PDT 2008


> We don't hold like Tosafos, though. We presume very little to define
>  the eidim as a separate appointed kat. Even those who want, lechumrah,
>  to be chosheish for their shitah and make an explicit appointment of
>  the eidim would not invalidate the qidushin le'achar ma'aseh. It's not
>  ikar hadin.
>
>  We can't revive a rejected shitah for the sake of permitting agunos,
>  as it would also destroy numerous (the overwhelming majority) of
>  marriages.
>
>  SheTir'u baTov!
>  -micha

Hold up a second - I'm confused. EMT said Tosafot holds that all the
potential witnesses in the vicinity count, while the contrary
(majority) opinion says only the specifically designated witnesses
count.

Therefore, I said that according to Tosafot, an O at an R wedding is
no problem, because all the Rs in the vicinity will pasul him. And
according to the other opinion, since the designated eidim are R, the
Os in the vicinity don't matter.

My solution to agunot, viz. grill the designated witnesses, would thus
seem to fit with the non-Tosafot opinion of designated witnesses.

But now you *imply* that the positions are switched - Tosafot holds
only the designated witnesses count, while everyone else says that
anyone in the vicinity counts. According to this, my aguna solution
only works with minority Tosafot but not majority (but at least O at
an R wedding is still no problem, since both shitot have no problem
with it, it doesn't matter who said what). But if EMT switched the
positions, I'd have expected an explicit declaration of this fact from
you, rather than an implication. So could you please clarify?

Mikha'el Makovi



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