[Mesorah] a kleinigkeit

[Toby Katz]

>>  Regarding the word "hamibb'li," all printed Chumashim have the
punctuation as is above, with a hataph-patah under the he'.

However, that is not the punctuation in the kisvei yad that represent the
Ben-Asher masorah.  Rather, all of them, without exception have a full
patah — WITH a ge‘aya/AKA meteg.  As the meritorious members of this group
are aware, that means that the syllable "ha" is lengthened and has a
secondary stress.<<


--R' Seth Mandel


.>>>>>


I am not in a position to weigh in on the dikduk or the trop here, but it
occurs to me that there may be a semantic aspect to this discussion.
Usually a "he-hasheila" indicates that what follows is a question, i.e., a
request for information.  But in this case the pasuk is not a request for
information.  It is a rhetorical question, a sarcastic statement in fact:
"You had to bring us to the desert to die?  What, there weren't enough
graves in Egypt?!"  And that's why here "a lengthened ha with a secondary
stress" may be indicated, in contrast to the usual short ha with a
chataf-patach when an ordinary question is being asked.


--Toby Katz

t613k at aol.com



On Sun, Jan 28, 2018 at 11:31 AM, Jeremy Rosenbaum Simon via Mesorah <
mesorah at lists.aishdas.org> wrote:

> Given that both R. Breuer and Bar Ilan have a chataf parachute, I find it
> difficult to credit you claim that _all_ ben Asher manuscripts have a full
> patach. Neither of them would have deviated from Leningrad, which indeed
> has a full patach, without good support. And dikduk rules would not factor
> significantly.
>
> Jeremy
>
> On Jan 28, 2018, at 11:11 AM, Mandel, Seth via Mesorah <
> mesorah at lists.aishdas.org> wrote:
>
> I call it that because most people only care about masorah if it changes
> the meaning or the pronunciation.
>
> But the non-defenestrated denizens of the Mesorah group understand that
> the masorah is much deeper than such things, and is important in light of
> the number of rishonim who spent time on it.
>
> So I am mentioning something that I shamefully admit that I was unaware of
> all my years:
>
> In the pasuq:
>
> *יד:יא* וַיֹּאמְרוּ, אֶל-מֹשֶׁה הֲמִבְּלִי אֵיןקְבָרִים בְּמִצְרַיִם
> לְקַחְתָּנוּ לָמוּת בַּמִּדְבָּר, מַה-זֹּאת עָשִׂיתָ לָּנוּ לְהוֹצִיאָנוּ
> מִמִּצְרָיִם.
> regarding the word "hamibb'li," all printed Chumashim have the punctuation
> as is above, with a hataph-patah under the he'.
>
> However, that is not the puncuation in the kisvei yad that represent the
> Ben-Asher masorah.  Rather, all of them, without exception have a full
> patah — WITH a ge‘aya/AKA meteg.  As the meritorious members of this group
> are aware, that means that the syllable "ha" is lengthened and has a
> secondary stress.
>
> The Minchas Shai already noticed this issue.  He notes that R. Yonah had
> it with a full patah, and it is the R'DaQ who says it should be a
> hataph-patah based on S'faradi mss.  He even goes on to say that there are
> some who claim that the ms. on which R.Yonah was basing himself was the
> Aleppo Codex.  That means to me that the Minchas Shay, without being able
> to decide the matter, attaches serious weight to the view of R. Yonah.
>
> In any event, now we can be certain based on the better mss. that we have.
>
> Prescriptive grammarians, who hold that the he' hash'elah should always
> have a hataph-patah, of course will be disturbed.  But as we know, the
> Masorah did not believe in prescriptive grammar, only in descriptive.
>
>
>
> Rabbi Dr. Seth Mandel
> Rabbinic Coordinator
> The Orthodox Union
>
> Voice (212) 613-8330     Fax (212) 613-0718     e-mail mandels at ou.org
>
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