[Avodah] potatos on Pesach

[Zev Sero via Avodah]

On 03/04/17 16:17, Eli Turkel via Avodah wrote:
>> This claim comes up regularly, but as far as I can tell it's not
>> true. If anyone has actually seen this inside the Chayei (or
>> Nishmas or whatever) Adam, please correct me by citing the
>> location

> Nishmas/ /Adam/, /Hilchos/ /Pesach/, Question 20 (from the article
> on Potatos)

Yes, I'm obviously aware of this reference, which *does not say* what so 
many people cite it as saying, because they saw it cited to that effect 
somewhere else, and have not bothered looking it up.  This is frankly 
getting up my nose, which is why I specified that I am not interested in 
citations that the poster has not looked up himself and verified that 
they actually say what they are represented as saying.


> mentions retzke that are called tatarka which are used to
> make flour are kitniyot My yiddish is very limited I saw one place
> that translated this as corn while another used buckwheat

Retchke, or Gretchke, means normal buckwheat (Fagopyrum esculentum). 
Tatarke means Tartary buckwheat (Fagopyrum tataricum).


> later on the Nishmas Adam talks about bulbus which is called
> erdeffel which I saw a translation as potatos.

Yes, bulbes are potatoes.  as in the famous song "Zuntik bulbes, Montik 
bulbes".


> If this translation is
> accurate then the Nishmas Adam is quoting a bet din in Germany that
> allowed potatos on Pesach in case of a major famine.

He reports having heard that in 1771-72 there was a famine and the 
community of Frth convened a beis din which permitted potatoes and 
kitniyos, but not buckwheat.  His purpose in citing this is simply to 
demonstrate that buckwheat is worse than kitniyos, since even in this 
extreme case they refused to permit it.  Of course this immediately 
causes the reader to wonder why they'd need a heter for potatoes, so he 
throws in the explanation that in Germany they don't eat them on Pesach.

Of course anyone who sees this can see immediately that (a) he reports 
this practise neutrally, without expressing any support for it, and (b) 
he doesn't claim first hand knowledge that it even exists, but merely 
repeat a rumour he'd heard about some other place.  Somehow, in the 
hands of irresponsible people, this seems to have transformed into the 
received wisdom that he forbade potatoes, or wanted to forbid them, or 
thought they ought to be forbidden, etc, none of which has the slightest 
tinge of truth, and it's perpetuated by lazy and dishonest people who 
repeat it as fact, complete with a fake citation which they have not 
bothered to verify.  This, in turn, by exaggerating the extent of 
gezeras kitniyos, is used to make it seem ridiculous, onerous, 
impractical, and ripe for reform.



On 03/04/17 16:43, Micha Berger via Avodah wrote:
> The Nishmas Adam merely reported that the ruling / custom exists.

and did so merely as a rumour.

-- 
Zev Sero                May 2017, with its *nine* days of Chanukah,
zev at sero.name           be a brilliant year for us all