[Avodah] Mussaf After Minchah

Zev Sero zev at sero.name
Wed Feb 13 10:40:35 PST 2013

On 12/02/2013 10:06 PM, Moshe Y. Gluck wrote:
> As per the SA OC 286:4, someone who didn’t daven Mussaf yet, and it’s
> already past Minchah Ketanah, should daven Minchah first, and then daven
> Mussaf.

You mean mincha gedola.  (The yesh omrim says that if you don't have to
daven mincha yet then it's optional, and the Rema says on that that after
mincha ketana it's not optional even according to the yesh omrim.)

> Here’s a question I’ve had a long time which I’ve never seen addressed.
> Someone who davens Nusach Ashkenaz says Shalom Rav at Minchah; here,
> where he says Minchah first, should he say Shalom Rav at Mussaf also?

No, because there is still nesias kapayim at mussaf.  (Even on Simchas
Torah, when we don't actually duchen, we say nesias kapayim because it's
the time for it, and if we had a cohen who had not yet made kiddush we
could do it.)

> (My only thought on this is that the minhag – as codified in the siddur
> – seems to be that he should say Sim Shalom. My R’ayah L’davar is that
> I’ve never seen a siddur that brought an option to say Shalom Rav at Mussaf.)

That's not a proof, because the siddur isn't designed to cater for such
unusual cases.  For that matter, how many Ashkenazi siddurim for chu"l
have you seen that have birchas kohanim in shacharis?  And yet we do it
on Simchas Torah.

In fact I rarely see a bencher that has the brachos to say before the
fourth bracha if you realise just at that moment that you forgot to say
retzei or yaaleh veyavo.  I suppose the reason most benchers omit them
is that it's unusual to remember just at that moment, and once you've
gone past "Hashem" in the fourth bracha it's too late, but still they
should be there.

Zev Sero               A citizen may not be required to offer a 'good and
zev at sero.name          substantial reason' why he should be permitted to
                        exercise his rights. The right's existence is all
                        the reason he needs.
                            - Judge Benson E. Legg, Woollard v. Sheridan

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