[Avodah] Birkat eirusiin

[Micha Berger]

On Mon, Aug 20, 2012 at 02:41:55PM -0400, Micha Berger wrote:
: Someone who already heard Qiddush could make Qiddush for another. And
: a husband, who already fulfilled Qiddush deOraisa when saying the
: Amidah for Maariv can be motzi his wife in her chiyuv deOraisa for
: Qiddush. (Although it is a popular topic in lomdus to discuss why,
: then, she shouldn't take priority and preferably be the one to make
: Qiddush.)

Looking over the AhS (OC 271:5-6) it looks like I erred. Se'if 6
explicitly states that there *is* a problem when one who davened wants
to be motzi(ah) one who hadn't.

The AhS explains how a man can come home and make qiddush for his wife
by making a chiluq between birkhos hamitzvah and birkhos hanehenin. By
birkhos hamitzvah we say kol Yisrael areivim gives me permission to make
a berakhah for someone when I'm not chayav. For birkhos hanehenin I have
to equally need the berakhah.

So now I'm wondering when do we only require the shaliach be a bikhal
chiyuv (like a man being shaliach leqabalah for a get) and when do
we require them to actually at that moment have at least equal chiyuv
(like a birkhas hanehenin)?

Tir'u baTov!
-Micha

-- 
Micha Berger             The Maharal of Prague created a golem, and
micha at aishdas.org        this was a great wonder. But it is much more
http://www.aishdas.org   wonderful to transform a corporeal person into a
Fax: (270) 514-1507      "mensch"!     -Rav Yisrael Salanter