[Avodah] Theoretical and Real Shiurim

[Lisa Liel]

On 4/5/2012 2:46 PM, Micha Berger wrote:
> First, the disclaimer... Recall that I don't think determining the
> historical size of the kezayis can create qulos.
>    
 >snip<
> But to return to my theme:
>
> I really think that the argument has to be halachic, or else we need
> to be machmir anyway so as not to violate minhag Yisrael on the range
> of accepted pesaqim. No? Accepted halakhah (nispasheit lekhol Yisrael)
> creates legal authority.
See, I can't agree with that.  Not when it's clearly a mistake.  Not 
when there was clearly a lack of knowledge and a chumra was created for 
the purpose of being super-extra-positively-safe.

If we -- today -- had never seen an olive and were simply using the term 
k'zayit because that's what it says in the Gemara, we'd have to make a 
WAG as to the size of an olive.  Erring on the side of bigger, of 
course.  But we'd do so, as reasonably rational people, knowing and 
expecting that if and when the day came that we were able to establish 
the reality of the situation, that reality would take the place of our 
WAG.  We certainly wouldn't have any kavana to replace the reality with 
our WAG simply because we were, for geographic or economic reasons, 
unable to determine that reality.  Not even if it became the generally 
accepted shiur over time.

Furthermore, there is no universally accepted shiur.  There are 
different shitot.  So how can any of them, or even all of them in the 
aggregate, replace the reality?

If I understand you, you're concerned that changing this thing based on 
real physical evidence could undermine rabbinic authority in general.  
But I think that people are reasonably rational enough to make a 
distinction and to understand that olives simply weren't accessible at 
the time of Rashi.

Again, even given the fact that people like Rashi were miles above us in 
Torah knowledge, that doesn't mean that they were miles above us in all 
knowledge.

Lisa