[Avodah] dina demalchuta

[Rich, Joel]

In '07 <http://www.aishdas.org/avodah/vol23/v23n020.shtml#14> RAF (who must have been living in South Switzerland at the time, "Shalom Y'all"?) pointed out that DDD means three things:

1- The power of civil law to define minhag hasokherim,
2- the power of taxation
3- the responsibility to maintain a safe and orderly society.

Taxes is a weak example, since the Rabbeinu Tam's hefqer BD hefqer rationale only supports the latter two. Claiming "other laws of the kingdom" involves the third category.

All this began with a question about whether one is permitted/obligated to violate DDD to implement "kofin oso ad sheyomar rotzeh ani". Which is a different topic than taxation.

Tir'u baTov!
-Micha

--------------------------------------------------------------------
And to bring things full circle - the language of the Rambam is clear that a beit din makes the determination of kofin oso and it's bkol zman/makom.  My thought was that this implies to me that beit din is acting under 3 above in this case (i.e. the power of melech) else where do we see beit din from power of sanhedrin having the right to use "non halachic" force (my own thought and if I'm off base, I'd be the first to admit it)
KT
Joel Rich
THIS MESSAGE IS INTENDED ONLY FOR THE USE OF THE 
ADDRESSEE.  IT MAY CONTAIN PRIVILEGED OR CONFIDENTIAL 
INFORMATION THAT IS EXEMPT FROM DISCLOSURE.  Dissemination, 
distribution or copying of this message by anyone other than the addressee is 
strictly prohibited.  If you received this message in error, please notify us 
immediately by replying: "Received in error" and delete the message.  
Thank you.