[Avodah] anti-meat rhetoric "according to Judaism"

[Micha Berger]

On Wed, Jul 14, 2010 at 05:50:28PM -0400, Jacob Farkas wrote:
: As I pointed out, there is no precedent in avoiding TBC regarding meat
: production, and with good reason. In pasture raised animals and
: poultry, there is no Tza'ar factor. So while it isn't pointless
: cruelty like dogfighting, the entire shift in production from a method
: that yields no Tza'ar, to a method that includes these horrible
: conditions, is a shift based in higher regard for profits than animal
: welfare.

You have yet to prove that's a halachic problem. My whole point is that
TBC doesn't take much to be mutar -- who said increased profits isn't
sufficient justification?

Here's my take on TBC. Animals have no "I", no awareness of their own
mental states. This appears to be true based on brain anatomy (they
lack a prefrontal cortex, which is where the job gets done in us),
in their not being attributed with bechirah chafshi (and therefore
have no need to monitor and edit their thoughts), nor a ruach
memalela (the aspect of the soul the Gra assigns the functions of
ego and bechirah to).
See <http://www.aishdas.org/avodah/vol10/v10n091.shtml#14>.

Thus TBC is an excercise in not getting used to cruelty, but isn't
actually about avoiding cruelty in the real sense of the word. TBC is
because we anthropomorphise animal pain, and could ch"v get used to
ignoring another's suffering.

You are setting a threshold based on the notion that there is real
suffering going on that carries a moral burden to avoid. Who said?

Like the Ramban's explanation of why a chazan cannot say "al kan
tzipor yagi'u Rakhamekha", that shiluach haqen is a gezeirah to teach
us compassion, not compassion on the bird itself, similarly TBC. An
animal can have pain, but without meta-awareness of that pain, it
can not suffer.

Therefore, as long as the person has a real point, why would it be
iqar hadin to harm an animal? Even if that point is to eat more meat
than absolutely necessary, or earn more money. As long as the focus
isn't about being mean to another.

-Micha

-- 
Micha Berger             Zion will be redeemed through justice,
micha at aishdas.org        and her returnees, through righteousness.
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