[Avodah] Seeing G'zeiros Everywhere

[Micha Berger]

On Sun, Jan 03, 2010 at 05:07:58AM +0000, rabbirichwolpoe at gmail.com wrote:
: Given: someone claims g'zeira means coercion

Nispasheit implies coersion?

: 1 SA Ch M 2:1 "..Danin bein Missa, bain mammom bein kol dinei onesh..."
: 
: A Is G'zeira - as a form of coercion - a greater or lesser coercion than
:   the list above?"
: B If less would it be muttar for a BD to impose it by kal vachomer? 
: C If not - why not?

The making of law would require official authority to make law. The
notion that they can coerce in other, notably case-wise ways, wouldn't
prove the point.

Otherwise, the concept of Ravina veR' Ashi sof hora'ah wouldn't mean
much either. Your argument for gezeiros would be equally applicable to
hora'ah.

R' Gershom used a cheirem, thereby using the tool of coercion that is
permitted to be used at the talmid chakham's discretion to protect the
kavod haTorah and those who represent it to enforce his own words. It's
a clever loophole, but I would think that it's one that only works
bedavka because of the role of cheirem in protecting kavod harav.

: 2 Can someone explain to me SA Ch. M. 11:1 the Remaks use of the term
: g'zeira?
: In particular the phrase "..g'zeiras BD o hacham.."

There the word is meant as "ruling". It refers to someone who doesn't
come to court and doen't care what the BD or any chakham says about him or
the case anyway. The context is clearly not legislation or interpretation,
but litigation.

...
: [Quoting from] The Use of Hearing Aids on Shabbat \ Rabbi Elysha Sandler
:> With regard to speaking to a person wearing hearing aids, three possible
:> prohibitions should be considered:
: ... 
:> C. Gezeira shema yetakein (Lest one make repairs) The Shulchan Aruch
:> rules that on Shabbat "it is forbidden to produce sound with a musical
:> insturment."...
:> Although the Talmud seems to limit this prohibition to the production of
:> a "sound of song," the wording of Shulchan Aruch clearly indicates that
:> in his opinion this prohibition includes the production of any sound on
:> a musical insturment.49

So here it seems that the whole debate is the extent of a gezeirah that
does date back to a Sanhedrin. Not the creation of a new one.

Tir'u baTov!
-Micha

-- 
Micha Berger                 Life is complex.
micha at aishdas.org                Decisions are complex.
http://www.aishdas.org               The Torah is complex.
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