[Avodah] a community taking seriously the text of piyutim it says

[Zev Sero]

Michael Poppers wrote:
> Since some point to the pizmon of "B'motzaei m'nuchah" as evidence
> that Ashk'nazim should start saying Elul-week S'lichos on Saturday
> night after chatzos halayla rather than prior to Shacharis on Sunday
> morning, I thought I would mention two phrases which those "some"
> presumably said on the first day of Rosh haShanah

Actually I said neither, and had never heard of these piyutim until
just now, but never mind.  In both cases you have seriously
misinterpreted the piyut, which says nothing even remotely similar
to what you think it does.


> Melech taliso kasheleg m'tzuchtzach/The King whose cloak is like 
> purified snow....
> 
> Do you wear an all-white talis/dress in white? How 'bout your
> community?

No.  Why would we do so?  What do you see in this line to suggest
that we ought to do so?  The reference is obviously to Daniel 7:9
and is completely uncontroversial, but what has it go to to do with
our own taleisim?  If anything it can be taken to (very slightly)
imply that we should *not* wear an all-white talles, unlike those
who do.



> (I consider this point about as strong as the "B'motzaei m'nuchah" 
> point, i.e. not very :).

Huh?  How are they even remotely similar?


> The next one, I consider to be stronger....) 
> -2-

> ** Chaq zichronos _v'qolos_ eser/the measure of remembrance _and of 
> Shofar tones_ is ten **;
> Does your community have exactly ten "Shofar tones" during the Amidah 
> (or at least during the chazarah)?

Again, you have seriously misinterpreted this line.  Like every
community we do indeed say ten malchiyos, ten zichronos, and ten
shofros, just as the piyut says we do.  Actually we say more than
ten malchiyos, but -- contrary to your claim -- the piyut does *not*
say we limit ourselves to exactly ten; it just says that we do say
ten, which is perfectly true.  Even if the piyut *had* said that
we blow the shofar ten times, there would be no contradiction, since
we all do that -- and then most of us blow many more; but the fact
is that it doesn't, and doesn't even hint at such a thing.

If you want something equivalent to "Bemotza'ei menucha", see the
serious discussion about "Avur ki fana yom" which is followed some
time later by "Hayom yifneh, hashemesh yavo veyifneh", and how to
avoid speaking falsehood.

-- 
Zev Sero                      The trouble with socialism is that you
zev at sero.name                 eventually run out of other people’s money
                                                     - Margaret Thatcher