[Avodah] R' Angel & Geirus Redux

[Daniel Eidensohn]

Concerning the spiritual status of tinok shenishba

*Shabbat (68b): *Rab and Samuel both maintain: Even a child who was 
taken captive among Gentiles or a proselyte who became converted in the 
midst of Gentiles is as one who knew but subsequently forgot, and so he 
is liable. But R. Johanan and Resh Lakish maintain: Only one who knew 
but subsequently forgot [is liable], but a child who was taken captive 
among Gentiles, or a proselyte who became converted in the midst of 
Gentiles, is not culpable.

The halacha is in accord with Rav and Shmuel - they have sinned and 
require a korbon even though there was no way that the tinok shenishba 
would know about Shabbos.


It is problematic to understand the Rambam as viewing tinok shenisha as 
blameless.

*Rambam (Hilchos Mamrim 3:3) *has been censored. It ends off with the 
statement that the children of the apikorsim are tinok 
shenisba...Therefore it is proper to have them do teshuva  and to 
attract them with peaceful words until they come back to Torah - **and 
people should not be quick to kill them***.

See the index to sources on the Frankel Rambam that understand that if 
they don't repent they can be killed

Similarly the Chazon Ish is widely understood to view them as blameless 
- but that is not what he actually says

*Chazon Ish**[i]* <#_edn1>*(Hilchos Shechita 2:16): *I believe that the 
legal permission to kill heretics only exists in a period of time where 
G‑d’s Providence is revealed to everyone. In other words, only in such a 
time when miracles are common and they all heard the Bas Kol (Heavenly 
Voice) and they saw and acknowledged the unique Providence for the 
righteous of the generation. The heretics in those eras—despite the 
great manifestation of spirituality—had an especially powerful lust for 
pleasure and rejecting all religious obligations. In such circumstances, 
the destruction of the wicked served the clear purpose of improving the 
world. Everyone knew that corrupt moral and violating religious 
commandments brought about suffering in the world such as plague, war 
and famine. However at a time when there is the absence of such clear 
awareness of the importance of spirituality, then killing heretics does 
not bring about improvement but rather makes things worse. That is 
because in such a non‑spiritual world, the punishment of heretics is 
viewed as destructive and as religious coercion. Therefore, since the 
whole reason for punishing heretics is to improve society, it cannot 
apply to an era when it is not generally perceived as an improvement. 
Thus in our current situation, we are obligated to bring the 
non‑observant back to the light of religion—with acts of love and 
affection to the best of our ability.


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[i] <#_ednref1> *חזון איש (הלכות שחיטה סימן ב:טז):* ונראה דאין דין 
מורידין אלא בזמן שהשגחתו ית' גלוי' כמו בזמן שהיו נסים מצוין ומשמש בת 
קול, וצדיקי הדור תחת השגחה פרטית הנראית לעין כל, והכופרין אז הוא בנליזות 
מיוחדות בהטיית היצר לתאוות והפקרות, ואז היה ביעור רשעים גדרו של עולם 
שהכל ידעו כי הדחת הדור מביא פורעניות לעולם ומביא דבר וחרב ורעב בעולם, 
אבל בזמן ההעלם שנכרתה האמונה מן דלת העם אין במעשה הורדה גדר הפרצה אלא 
הוספת הפרצה שיהיה' בעיניהם כמעשה השחתה ואלמות ח"ו וכיון שכל עצמנו לתקן 
אין הדין נוהג בשעה שאין בו תיקון ועלינו להחזירם בעבותות אהבה ולהעמידם 
בקרן אורה במה שידינו מגעת.

Both the Rambam and Chazaon Ish obviously undertstand that tinok 
shenishba are in fact sinners - but there is greater benefit in being 
nice to them and having them rejoin religious society than in treating 
them harshly. In fact being harsh would cause major damage to society.

We are talking about tactics in teshuva and tochacha - not about whether 
they are blameless and innocent.

For those who want to see more sources - the Beis Yechezkeil of Rav 
Tzuriel has a chapter devoted to tinok shenishba. He also has a chapter 
on the subject in his Otzros HaMusar.