<html><head></head><body><div class="ydp9215a822yahoo-style-wrap" style="font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:16px;"><div><div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false">I produced a list of all the verses which do not have an Etnach. I dont think I can send it here to the group, but I can send to the individuals who will ask.</div><div><br></div><div class="ydp9215a822signature"><div style="color: black; font-style: normal; font-weight: normal; font-stretch: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-family: arial;">Aharon Gal<div>201-414-7190</div></div></div></div>
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On Thursday, December 28, 2023 at 05:32:10 PM EST, Yitzhak Ajzner via Mesorah <mesorah@lists.aishdas.org> wrote:
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<div><div id="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381"><div><div class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381WordSection1"><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;">Rav Breuer explains that what decides whether a verse will have an Etnahta or not, is how many words it has in its 2<sup>nd</sup> part, after its main break:</span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;">When a verse has more than 5 words in the 2<sup>nd</sup> section it always has an Etnahta.</span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;">See how these verses illustrate this very vividly:</span></p><p dir="RTL" style="text-align:right;direction:rtl;unicode-bidi:embed;" class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span dir="LTR" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;"> </span><span lang="HE" style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;">עֵ֥ת לָלֶ֖דֶת וְעֵ֣ת <span style="color:red;">לָמ֑וּת </span>עֵ֣ת לָטַ֔עַת וְעֵ֖ת לַעֲק֥וֹר נָטֽוּעַ׃ <span style="color:#00B050;">(5)</span></span></p><p dir="RTL" style="text-align:right;direction:rtl;unicode-bidi:embed;" class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span lang="HE" style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;">עֵ֤ת לַהֲרוֹג֙ וְעֵ֣ת <span style="color:red;">לִרְפּ֔וֹא </span>עֵ֥ת לִפְר֖וֹץ וְעֵ֥ת לִבְנֽוֹת׃ <span style="color:#00B050;">(4)</span></span></p><p dir="RTL" style="text-align:right;direction:rtl;unicode-bidi:embed;" class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span lang="HE" style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;">עֵ֤ת לִבְכּוֹת֙ וְעֵ֣ת <span style="color:red;">לִשְׂח֔וֹק </span>עֵ֥ת סְפ֖וֹד וְעֵ֥ת רְקֽוֹד׃ <span style="color:#00B050;">(4)</span></span></p><p dir="RTL" style="text-align:right;direction:rtl;unicode-bidi:embed;" class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span lang="HE" style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;">עֵ֚ת לְהַשְׁלִ֣יךְ אֲבָנִ֔ים וְעֵ֖ת כְּנ֣וֹס <span style="color:red;">אֲבָנִ֑ים </span>עֵ֣ת לַחֲב֔וֹק וְעֵ֖ת לִרְחֹ֥ק מֵחַבֵּֽק׃ <span style="color:#00B050;">(5)</span></span></p><p dir="RTL" style="text-align:right;direction:rtl;unicode-bidi:embed;" class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span dir="LTR" style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;color:#002060;"> </span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;"> </span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;"> </span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;">When there are 2-4 words in the 2<sup>nd</sup> section, then usually, but not always, there will be an etnahta. The more words (from 2-4), the greater the chance of the Etnahta.</span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;"> </span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;">When there is 1 word in the 2<sup>nd</sup> section, then there will usually NOT be an Etnahta, but there are quite a few exceptions. Here, when the verse contains more than 1 sentence, it increases the chances of an Etnahta:</span></p><p dir="RTL" style="text-align:right;direction:rtl;unicode-bidi:embed;" class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span lang="HE" style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;">וַיֹּ֥אמֶר אֱ-לֹהִ֖ים יְהִ֣י <span style="color:red;">א֑וֹר </span>וַֽיְהִי־אֽוֹר</span><span dir="LTR" style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;"></span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;"> </span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-AU" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;">But, see this verse, with no less than 23 words in it, but with no Etnahta! </span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-AU" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;">It divides into two on the Tipha, the strongest break before the Sof-passuk (note that 2 hyphenated words are always considered 1 word):</span></p><p dir="RTL" style="text-align:right;direction:rtl;unicode-bidi:embed;" class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span lang="HE" style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;">וַיַּקְהֵ֣ל דָּוִ֣יד אֶת־כׇּל־שָׂרֵ֣י יִשְׂרָאֵ֡ל שָׂרֵ֣י הַשְּׁבָטִ֣ים וְשָׂרֵ֣י הַמַּחְלְק֣וֹת הַמְשָׁרְתִ֪ים אֶת־הַמֶּ֟לֶךְ וְשָׂרֵ֣י הָאֲלָפִ֣ים וְשָׂרֵ֣י הַמֵּא֡וֹת וְשָׂרֵ֣י כׇל־רְכוּשׁ־וּמִקְנֶה֩ ׀ לַמֶּ֨לֶךְ וּלְבָנָ֜יו עִם־הַסָּרִיסִ֧ים וְהַגִּבּוֹרִ֛ים וּֽלְכׇל־גִּבּ֥וֹר <span style="color:red;">חָ֖יִל </span>אֶל־יְרוּשָׁלָֽ͏ִם</span><span dir="LTR" style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;"></span></p><p dir="RTL" style="text-align:right;direction:rtl;unicode-bidi:embed;" class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span dir="LTR" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;"> </span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;">(There are actually a handful of exceptions to the 1<sup>st</sup> rule I wrote above, when there are 5 words in the 2<sup>nd</sup> section, but each has a clear reason.)</span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;"> </span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;">After having written all that, I don’t see how it is relevant to the verse we are discussing:</span></p><p dir="RTL" style="text-align:right;direction:rtl;unicode-bidi:embed;" class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span lang="HE" style="font-size:18.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;">וַיַּעֲשׂ֥וּ בָנָ֖יו ל֑וֹ כֵּ֖ן כַּאֲשֶׁ֥ר צִוָּֽם</span><span dir="LTR"></span><span dir="LTR"></span><span dir="LTR" style="font-size:18.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;"><span dir="LTR"></span><span dir="LTR"></span> - </span><span lang="HE" style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:sans-serif;">בראשית נ, יב</span><span dir="LTR" style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:sans-serif;"></span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;"> </span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;">Sure, this verse, according to the above rules, could have </span><span lang="EN-AU" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;">been divided by</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;"> a Zakef.</span><span dir="RTL"></span><span dir="RTL"></span><span dir="RTL" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:sans-serif;color:#002060;"><span dir="RTL"></span><span dir="RTL"></span> </span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;">W</span><span lang="EN-AU" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;">hy does that matter?</span></p><p dir="RTL" style="text-align:right;direction:rtl;unicode-bidi:embed;" class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span lang="HE" style="font-size:18.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;">וַיַּעֲשׂ֤וּ בָנָיו֙ ל֔וֹ כֵּ֖ן כַּאֲשֶׁ֥ר צִוָּֽם</span><span dir="LTR" lang="EN-AU" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;"></span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span dir="RTL" lang="HE" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:sans-serif;color:#002060;"> </span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-AU" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;">If the verse would have been divided, as we would expect, on the word </span><span dir="RTL" lang="HE" style="font-size:18.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;">כֵּן</span><span dir="LTR"></span><span dir="LTR"></span><span lang="EN-AU" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;"><span dir="LTR"></span><span dir="LTR"></span>, then the te’amim would have been one of these options:</span></p><p dir="RTL" style="text-align:right;direction:rtl;unicode-bidi:embed;" class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span lang="HE" style="font-size:18.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;">וַיַּעֲשׂ֥וּ בָנָ֛יו ל֖וֹ כֵּ֑ן כַּאֲשֶׁ</span><span dir="LTR" style="font-size:18.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;">֖</span><span lang="HE" style="font-size:18.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;">ר צִוָּֽם</span><span dir="LTR" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;"></span></p><p dir="RTL" style="text-align:right;direction:rtl;unicode-bidi:embed;" class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span dir="LTR" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;"> </span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;">O</span><span lang="EN-AU" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;">r:</span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-AU" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;"> </span></p><p dir="RTL" style="text-align:right;direction:rtl;unicode-bidi:embed;" class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span lang="HE" style="font-size:18.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;">וַיַּעֲשׂ֨וּ בָנ</span><span dir="LTR" style="font-size:18.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;">ָ֥</span><span lang="HE" style="font-size:18.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;">יו ל</span><span dir="LTR" style="font-size:18.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;">֛</span><span lang="HE" style="font-size:18.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;">וֹ כֵּ</span><span dir="LTR" style="font-size:18.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;">֖</span><span lang="HE" style="font-size:18.0pt;font-family:Shlomo;">ן כַּאֲשֶׁ֥ר צִוָּֽם</span><span dir="LTR" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;"></span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-AU" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;">Don’t see any musical difficulty with either of them.</span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-AU" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;"> </span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-AU" style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;">Yitzhak</span></p><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Sans;color:#002060;"> </span></p><div id="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381yqt85016" class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381yqt5497541095"><div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm;"><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Mesorah <mesorah-bounces@lists.aishdas.org> <b>On Behalf Of </b>Rabbi Berysz Rosenberg via Mesorah<br clear="none"><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, 28 December 2023 3:58 PM<br clear="none"><b>To:</b> Yisrael Dubitsky <yidubitsky@gmail.com><br clear="none"><b>Cc:</b> mesorah@aishdas.org<br clear="none"><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Mesorah] <span dir="RTL" lang="HE">בראשית נ, יב</span></p></div><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"> </p><div><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal">Indeed two of the pesukim have 10 words each, but one of them has 3 makafim and one even 4. So from the point of view of neginah it's sort of 6 and 7, rather than 10 words.<br clear="all"></p><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"> </p><div><p><b><span style="font-size:13.5pt;">Rabbi Berysz Rosenberg</span></b><span style="font-size:9.5pt;"></span></p><div><p><span style="font-size:9.5pt;">12, Minhat Yitzhak Street</span></p></div><div><p><span style="font-size:9.5pt;">Jerusalem, 9448019</span></p></div><div><p><span style="font-size:9.5pt;">E. Israel</span></p></div><div><p><span style="font-size:9.5pt;">Phone: +97225306565</span></p><p><span style="font-size:9.5pt;">mobile: +972548589632 </span></p><p><span style="font-size:9.5pt;">SMS: +41792328026</span></p><p><span style="font-size:9.5pt;">Telefax: +972773181740</span></p><p><span style="font-size:9.5pt;">mobile Mrs. Rosenberg: +972548589638 </span></p><p><span style="font-size:9.5pt;">E-Mail: <a shape="rect" href="mailto:dovortov@gmail.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">dovortov@gmail.com</a></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"> </p></div><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"> </p><div><div><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal">Am Do., 28. Dez. 2023 um 15:41 Uhr schrieb Yisrael Dubitsky via Mesorah <<a shape="rect" href="mailto:mesorah@lists.aishdas.org" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">mesorah@lists.aishdas.org</a>>:</p></div><blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm;"><div><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal">Perhaps Price's Concordance will have the list -- but i havent checked it.</p><div><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal">but see Bereshit 10:13-17 for pesukim without an etnahta (among them 10-words-long pesukim).</p></div></div><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"> </p><div><div><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal">On Thu, Dec 28, 2023 at 2:55 PM Akiva Miller via Mesorah <<a shape="rect" href="mailto:mesorah@lists.aishdas.org" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">mesorah@lists.aishdas.org</a>> wrote:</p></div><blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm;"><div><div><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal">Aharon Gal wrote:</p></div><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal">> Pasuk of this size could have used Zakef as the main dichotomy.</p><div><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"> </p></div><div><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal">A pasuk without an esnachta?!? I've seen this only in the very shortest of pesukim. Az Yashir has two such cases (at 15:12 and 15:18), and they are both only four words long.</p></div><div><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"> </p></div><div><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal">OOOPS! I just saw that Shemos 15:24 lacks any esnachta, and it is a whopping 7 words long.</p></div><div><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"> </p></div><div><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal">Trivia question: Does anyone know which is the longest pasuk to lack an esnachta? For that matter, is there a pasuk anywhere that has two?</p></div><div><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal"> </p></div><div><p style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;" class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal">Akiva Miller<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"></p></div></div><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal">_______________________________________________<br clear="none">Mesorah mailing list<br clear="none"><a shape="rect" href="mailto:Mesorah@lists.aishdas.org" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Mesorah@lists.aishdas.org</a><br clear="none"><a shape="rect" href="http://lists.aishdas.org/listinfo.cgi/mesorah-aishdas.org" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://lists.aishdas.org/listinfo.cgi/mesorah-aishdas.org</a></p></blockquote></div><p class="ydpb8e65101yiv0160818381MsoNormal">_______________________________________________<br clear="none">Mesorah mailing list<br clear="none"><a shape="rect" href="mailto:Mesorah@lists.aishdas.org" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Mesorah@lists.aishdas.org</a><br clear="none"><a shape="rect" href="http://lists.aishdas.org/listinfo.cgi/mesorah-aishdas.org" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://lists.aishdas.org/listinfo.cgi/mesorah-aishdas.org</a></p></blockquote></div></div></div></div></div><div class="ydpb8e65101yqt5497541095" id="ydpb8e65101yqt02873">_______________________________________________<br clear="none">Mesorah mailing list<br clear="none"><a shape="rect" href="mailto:Mesorah@lists.aishdas.org" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Mesorah@lists.aishdas.org</a><br clear="none"><a shape="rect" href="http://lists.aishdas.org/listinfo.cgi/mesorah-aishdas.org" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://lists.aishdas.org/listinfo.cgi/mesorah-aishdas.org</a><br clear="none"></div></div>
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