<div dir="ltr"><div>I recall (which means any inaccuracies are mine) my mesorah teacher (RSM) telling me that there are seven instances in this "ogera" - a collection of ad hoc exceptions to the regular dagesh rules. Four of them appear in Az Yashir. Mi kamocha should be missing a dagesh;
<span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">two instances of "go’ah g’ah," the second gimmel should not have a dagesh; at 15:15 (
<span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">“k’aven” instead of “ch’aven"). There's one in Yeshayahu
<span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">54:12.<span>
</span>“v’samti
kad’chod.” (And a few more).</span></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><br></span></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">The mesorah on the above is clear: no dagesh. There is also a tradition of machlokes in a few other places where we're not sure if the dagesh appears or not. One example I'm aware, which is yet another one from Az Yashir, is 15:13 "<span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Am zu go’olata"</span></span></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><br></span></span></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">FWIW. (R Seth, the above are from some notes I took while listening to you in 2011!)</span></span></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><br></span></span></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">-- Sholom</span></span></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><br></span>
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</div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Jul 3, 2020 at 9:25 AM Mandel, Seth via Mesorah <<a href="mailto:mesorah@lists.aishdas.org">mesorah@lists.aishdas.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
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<div dir="ltr">The form in mi kamokha: Minchat Shay gives an ad hoc guess. It is clear that that is what it is, because the form is included by all the Ba’alei haMasorah in “ogerah,” meaning a group for which in the Masorah there is no explanation.
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Sent from <a href="https://whatisworkspaceone.com/boxer" target="_blank">Workspace ONE Boxer</a><span id="gmail-m_4143761424350053394draft-break"></span><br>
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<div dir="auto">On July 3, 2020 at 5:31:15 AM EDT, Aharon Gal <<a href="mailto:galsaba@aol.com" target="_blank">galsaba@aol.com</a>> wrote:<br>
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<div style="overflow-wrap: break-word;"><font face="Lucida Grande"><span style="font-size:15px">Not a proof, but a סברה based on סבירות:</span></font>
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<div><font face="Lucida Grande"><span style="font-size:15px">According to the book "צורות הקשר וצורות הפסק בעברית שבמקרא” (Dr. Israel Ben David) in the תבנית of "פתח/קמץ במלרע" when the trop is Zakef Katon (Melech)
25% of the cases will come with Tzurat Hefsek . For Ravia it is 9%. Tzinor 8%, Dechi 2.4%. The trop on the last three is a Mishne.</span></font>
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<div><font style="font-size:15px" face="Lucida Grande">In the following Pesukim where the verb is in Zakef Katon (MELECH - the last two) the verb (binyan paal) come with Tzurat Hemshech (Kamatz Patach)</font></div>
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<div><span style="font-size:15px"><font face="Lucida Grande"><span id="gmail-m_4143761424350053394M_6_21_21" style="box-sizing:content-box;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">וּמַלְאַ֣ךְ</span><span style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"> </span><span id="gmail-m_4143761424350053394M_6_21_22" style="box-sizing:content-box;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">ה'</span><span style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"> </span><span id="gmail-m_4143761424350053394M_6_21_23" style="box-sizing:content-box;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">הָלַ֖ךְ</span><span style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"> </span><span id="gmail-m_4143761424350053394M_6_21_24" style="box-sizing:content-box;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">מֵעֵינָֽיו</span></font></span></div>
<div><span style="box-sizing:content-box;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"><span style="text-align:justify;font-size:15px"><font face="Lucida Grande">ה'
<b>נָתַ֔ן</b> וַיהוָ֖ה לָקָ֑ח</font></span></span></div>
<div><span style="box-sizing:content-box;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);font-size:15px"><font face="Lucida Grande"><span id="gmail-m_4143761424350053394M_8_12_4" style="box-sizing:content-box">ה'</span> <span id="gmail-m_4143761424350053394M_8_12_5" style="box-sizing:content-box"><b>אָמַ֔ר</b></span> <span id="gmail-m_4143761424350053394M_8_12_6" style="box-sizing:content-box">לִשְׁכֹּ֖ן</span> <span id="gmail-m_4143761424350053394M_8_12_7" style="box-sizing:content-box">בָּעֲרָפֶֽל</span></font></span></div>
<div><span style="box-sizing:content-box;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"><font face="Lucida Grande"><span style="box-sizing:content-box;font-size:15px"><br>
</span></font></span></div>
<div><font style="font-size:15px" face="Lucida Grande">While in the verses in Tehillim where the verbs have trop MISHNE they are with Tzurat Hefsek:</font></div>
<div><font style="font-size:15px" face="Lucida Grande"><span style="text-align:justify;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"> </span><span style="text-align:justify;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">אִמְר֤וּ
בַגּוֹיִ֨ם | יְה֘וָ֤ה מָלָ֗ךְ (Tehillim 96:10)</span></font></div>
<div><span style="text-align:justify;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);font-size:15px"><font face="Lucida Grande">יְהוָ֣ה מָ֭לָךְ תָּגֵ֣ל הָאָ֑רֶץ (Tehillim 97:1)</font></span></div>
<div><span style="text-align:justify;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);font-size:15px"><font face="Lucida Grande">יְהוָ֣ה מָלָךְ֮ גֵּא֪וּת לָ֫בֵ֥שׁ (Tehillim 93:1)</font></span></div>
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<div><span style="font-size:15px"><font face="Lucida Grande">Aharon</font></span></div>
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<div>On Jul 2, 2020, at 11:28 PM, M. Hamm <<a href="mailto:msh210@gmail.com" target="_blank">msh210@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div>
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<div dir="auto">R' Seth Mandel: <<Conceptually, it might be appropriate to have different forms of verbs and adjectives used for God. Next time you invent a language, you can feel free to try. But in dealing with facts, no human language that
know of does that.>></div>
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Perhaps not, but <i>Tanach</i> has unusual constructions in His honor.
<i>Minchas Shay </i>IIRC gives His honor as a reason for the <i>
dagesh</i> in "<i>mi kamocha</i>" in <i>Az yashir</i>; and I
<b>seem</b> to recall reading somewhere that appearing between two copies of His name is why "<i>mik'dash</i>", also in <span style="font-family:sans-serif"><i>Az yashir</i>, has a
<i>dagesh</i> "<i>l'sif'eres</i>". So maybe </span><font face="sans-serif"><i>malach</i><i style="font-weight:bold">
</i>instead</font><span style="font-family:sans-serif"> of </span><font face="sans-serif"><i>mal'ach</i>, too?</font></div>
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</font></div>
<div dir="auto"><font face="sans-serif">M.</font></div>
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