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<body class='hmmessage'><div dir='ltr'><font face="Arial,sans-serif">What about the sh'wa in the bet/daled? I've always assumed they were nach and exceptions to the rules of (a) two sh'wa in a row, first is nach second is na and (b) anything with a dagesh and a sh'wa also being sh'wa na. Is that correct</font><BR><font face="Arial,sans-serif"></font> <BR><font face="Arial,sans-serif">While on that subject, what about the two sh'was in Rus 2:19 in Likatt (lamed, kuf, tes, tof). Are they also two sh'wa nachs? And if so, how can that be done with the tes and a tof? I cannot help but make the first one (the tes) a sh'wa na.</font><BR><font face="Arial,sans-serif"></font> <BR><font face="Arial,sans-serif">Yaakov Gorlin</font><BR><br> <BR><div><hr id="stopSpelling">To: michaelpoppers@gmail.com; mesorah@aishdas.org<br>Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2016 20:23:06 +0000<br>Subject: Re: [Mesorah] vayichadd<br>From: mesorah@lists.aishdas.org<br><br>
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I was m'qattzer, but Iintended to answer Sholom's question. The dagesh is qal, just as in <BR>
<span lang="HE" style='line-height: 115%; font-family: "David","sans-serif"; font-size: 12pt;' dir="RTL">åÇéÌÄùÑÀáÌÀ</span>, and the sh'wa is the same in both words. The underlying vowel of the chet is a sh'wa nach, which appears as a pasach because of the influence
of the chet.<br>
<span lang="HE" style='line-height: 115%; font-family: "David","sans-serif"; font-size: 12pt;' dir="RTL"></span><br>
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<div class="PlainText"><font face="Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif" size="3">Rabbi Dr. Seth Mandel<br>
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The Orthodox Union<br>
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Voice (212) 613-8330 Fax (212) 613-0718 e-mail mandels@ou.org</font></div>
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<div id="ecxdivRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font color="#000000" face="Calibri, sans-serif" style="font-size: 11pt;"><b>From:</b> Michael Poppers <michaelpoppers@gmail.com><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, January 24, 2016 2:45 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Mandel, Seth<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Sholom Simon<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Mesorah] vayichadd</font>
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Forgive me, but I think Sholom was asking why the last letter had a dageish and a sh'va (both of which seem extraneous) and may have also been asking what type of dageish was in the daled.</div>
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The little I can contribute is an observation: I only recall seeing the phenomenon with BGDKFTh letters, so it seems like the dageish is "qal" and meant to distinguish the consonant's sound. Strictly speaking, the sh'va [nach] may not be necessary, but it
clarifies (if there was any doubt) that the consonant is to be pronounced.</div>
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<div class="ecxgmail_quote">On Sun, Jan 24, 2016 at 1:15 PM, Mandel, Seth via Mesorah
<span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:mesorah@lists.aishdas.org" target="_blank">mesorah@lists.aishdas.org</a>></span> wrote:<br>
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<div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" dir="ltr">
As an early rishon (IIRC, R Yonah ibn Jannah) said, this is basically the same form as
<span lang="HE" style='line-height: 115%; font-family: "David","sans-serif"; font-size: 12pt;' dir="RTL">
åÇéÌÄùÑÀáÌÀ</span><br>
<span lang="HE" style='line-height: 115%; font-family: "David","sans-serif"; font-size: 11pt;' dir="RTL"><span lang="HE" style='line-height: 115%; font-family: "David","sans-serif"; font-size: 11pt;' dir="RTL"></span></span>However, the sh'wa under the shin
becomes a pasach under the influence of the chet.<br>
<span lang="HE" style='line-height: 115%; font-family: "David","sans-serif"; font-size: 12pt;' dir="RTL"></span><BR>
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<div><font size="2"><span style="font-size: 10pt;">
<div><font face="Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif" size="3">Rabbi Dr. Seth Mandel<br>
Rabbinic Coordinator<br>
The Orthodox Union<br>
</font><font face="Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif" size="3"><br>
Voice <a target="_blank">(212) 613-8330</a> Fax
<a target="_blank">(212) 613-0718</a> e-mail
<a href="mailto:mandels@ou.org" target="_blank">mandels@ou.org</a></font></div>
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<div dir="ltr"><font color="#000000" face="Calibri, sans-serif" style="font-size: 11pt;"><b>From:</b> Mesorah <<a href="mailto:mesorah-bounces@lists.aishdas.org" target="_blank">mesorah-bounces@lists.aishdas.org</a>> on behalf of Sholom Simon via Mesorah <<a href="mailto:mesorah@lists.aishdas.org" target="_blank">mesorah@lists.aishdas.org</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, January 23, 2016 8:59 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:mesorah@lists.aishdas.org" target="_blank">mesorah@lists.aishdas.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Mesorah] vayichadd</font>
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Shemos 18:9 starts off with the word "vayichadd" -- the final dalet having a dagesh and a shva.<BR>
Apologies if this is a simple question: what is that? Why does the word need that as an ending?<BR>
Shavua tov!<BR>
-- Sholom<BR>
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