<html><head></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"><div>There is a 3rd alternative: <i>that we don’t know.</i> </div><div><br></div><div>I believe this is the position of <u>most</u> irreligious people; not atheism but agnosticism. </div><div><br></div><div>They don’t <u>disbelieve</u> in a Creator, they merely say, the evidence for a Creator is no stronger than the evidence for a lucky accidental fluctuation in the nothingness of the mutiverse.</div><div><br></div><div>You and I obviously disagree with their assessment, but that’s what they say.</div><div><br></div><div>BTW, I am presently reading a wonderful book that anyone interested in this topic would do well to read.</div><div><br></div><div>It’s called <i>The Cosmic Code</i> by the late Prof. <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heinz_Pagels">Heinz Pagels</a>.</div><div><br></div><div>He tells the story of Einstein, Bohr, Relativity and Quantum Mechanics in a very engaging and understandable way (i.e., as a story), and continually refers to God as the creator, and the scientist’s job is to understand God’s creation. It doesn’t come across as religious (I don’t know whether or not he was) but respectful of theism, in a very Einsteinian way (“I don’t believe God plays dice.”). He didn’t know Einstein personally, but studied at Princeton with people who knew him, and Einstein was often quoted as saying he got his intuitive insights from “The Old One”. </div><div><br></div><div>Here’s the book: <a href="http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0486485064?ie=UTF8&tag=j099-20">http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0486485064?ie=UTF8&tag=j099-20</a></div><div><br></div><div>FYI</div><div><br></div><div>Alexander Seinfeld</div><span id="OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION"><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verdana; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><br></div><blockquote id="MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE" style="BORDER-LEFT: #b5c4df 5 solid; PADDING:0 0 0 5; MARGIN:0 0 0 5;"><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verdana; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">The idea of matter being infinite (always having existed) is just as</div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verdana; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">impossible to understand as the idea of an infinite Creator that is beyond</div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verdana; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">scientific detection in the physical world -- and believe that by using</div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verdana; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">random natural selection they hae obviated the need to believe in Him.</div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verdana; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><br></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verdana; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">They will then challenge that idea by asking 'Who created God?' ad</div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verdana; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">infinitum, thus believing they have refuted the 'first cause'</div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verdana; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">premise. They somehow do not understand the concept of 'First cause'. By</div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verdana; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">definition, the 'creation buck' stops there! The Creator' needs no</div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verdana; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">creator because He has always existed. difficult to understand but no</div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verdana; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">less difficult than saying the universe has always existed.</div></blockquote></span></body></html>