MB said" Very few tastes can be identified below that level"<br>
<br>
RRP, responded "All kinds of tastes and textures can be detected below that level. What<br>
may be true is that unintentional additions rarely do harm. I would bet<br>
that intentional ones aderabba often would/could be detected!"<br><br>MB asks politely, Really? Can you name a non kosher ingredient that can be POSITIVELY IDENTIFIED when less than 1/60th of a mixture? I've never tried it, but I'm guessing even bacon juice in a glass of milk is nulified. In fact that does seem to be the position of the Nodeh B'Yehudah.<br>
<br>RRW said<br>"This 1/60 ratio as posted earlier has been used as a mindless slogan<br>
by those who aren't posqim."<br><br>MB responded, politely,<br>" Mindless? Well, at least I'm in some good company."<br><br>And RRW, replying to this question<br>"> The ingredient was added deliberately, but by a non-Jew, so does it<br>
> count as L'chatchila or B'diavad?"<br><br>RRW, said<br>
<br>
"If added FOR A JEW it is not bateil ever.<br>
See<br>
SA YD 99:5-6<br>
Esp. Shach 11<br>
GRA 9<br>
Taz 10<br>
Hidushei R Aqiva Eiger"<br><br>MB, politely, says," Well the goal posts suddenly got moved. <br>We were discussing, I thought, already manufactured products that contained intentional bittul. As these were made by gentiles for gentile markets, then this question shouldn't arise.<br>
But if such a mixture was made by a Jew for a Jew, I agree it's not permitted, for the Jew it was intended, but it can be consumed by or even sold to another Jew.<br>The example that I use for demonstration purposes only, is salmon paste. Ingredients salmon, vegetable oil, salt and pepper. I decide, for fun , to add 1% shrimp to the mixture.<br>
The shrimp is battel both in taste( and for those that insist, in texture and colour). I now cannot eat that myself, nor the guests that it was intended for .<br>However, I can give it to my favourite Rabbi, or sell it (at the non-kosher price) to my oh so frum next door neighbour.<br>
See Shach 99:12 and YD:99:5, and I think Taz 99:10 permits my guests to eat it, if they don't know I deliberately treifed it up.<br><br>Bon appetit.<br clear="all"><br>-- <br>Martin Brody<br><br>