<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, May 13, 2008 at 4:51 PM, Micha Berger <<a href="mailto:micha@aishdas.org">micha@aishdas.org</a>> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
I just wrote in reply to RRW:<br>
:: So give me the sources for dancing on Shabbos against codified<br>
:: Mishna!...<br>
<br>
: The Rama (OCh 339:3) cites the Tosafos (Beitzah 30a "Tenan"). They are<br>
: meikil on the gezeirah of instruments, since no one tunes their own<br>
: instruments where they actually are tunable.<br>
</blockquote><div><br>A careful read of said Rema shows clearly tht he is NOT endoorsing this minhag, only tolearting it in the 2nd yeish omrim. In the first case, he says mutav sheyihyu shoggegeim, hardly a resounding endoresement!<br>
<br> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"><br>
: It's clear from the Rambam's formulation (Shaabos 32:4), who stresses<br>
: the connection implied in the mishnah -- the issur is against rhythm. We<br>
: discussed something similar in parshanus: there is indication that<br>
: mecholos is a kind of dancing, and another that it was an intrument. If<br>
: dancing, it's a dance that focusses on producing a rhythm with one's<br>
: feet. Don't tap dance.<br>
:<br>
: Is that a weak justification? Yes. It would require strong support from<br>
: outside the textual formalism realm in order to become pesaq...<br>
</blockquote><div><br>Point it is unsupported in Bavli or even otherr Amoraic-era works. Even in Ashkenaz there is not poseik I know amongst Rishonim that endorsed Tsosafos on this point, rather they were melamed z'chus on those who deviated. <br>
<br></div>Lemme say this. I don't know what the bottom line is. I am jsut saying if Ortho's can dance on Sahbbas despite this Mishna it is imho just as justifiable for C's to play a guita, flute, or piano on Shabbos. {I'm avoiding organs due to electricity etc.] [I also realize that one CAN make a hair-slit hilluk and defend dancing
and still attack playing instruments - but I frankly find these
arguments rationalizations and not ehrlich.]<br>
<br>Mah nafshach. You either take a legal/technical view on teh matter or a fuzzy touchy-feely appoach about the greater good yada yada yada...<br></div><br>-- <br>Kol Tuv / Best Regards,<br>RabbiRichWolpoe@Gmail.com<br>
see: <a href="http://nishmablog.blogspot.com/">http://nishmablog.blogspot.com/</a>