<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Feb 25, 2008 at 8:14 AM, <a href="mailto:kennethgmiller@juno.com">kennethgmiller@juno.com</a> <<a href="mailto:kennethgmiller@juno.com">kennethgmiller@juno.com</a>> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"><div class="Ih2E3d"><br>
<br>
</div>Yes, it is possible for someone of lower stature can overturn someone of higher stature, if his svara and/or raayos are strong enough. The Gra did it, Rav Moshe did it, and many others did it.<br>
<br>
But RRW's use of the word "ANYONE" makes it sound like individual balabatim all over the world have taken it upon themselves to pretend that they're smarter than Rav Moshe.<br>
</blockquote><div><br>Nothing to do with smartness. Teyuvta's are not a function of greater intelligence- jsut superior sources! [according to the abover reasoning since R. Chaim Brisker has the hiehge3st
IQ therefore his minhag of using tea bags with just a simple kli sheini
on Shabbas is normative halachah! that is the IQ-centric view of
halachah]<br><br>Rather,anyone who can bring rayas and make a cogent argument can overturn anyone else. yes that is what I meant<br><br><br>Example: See th Bach at the beginning of Bassar bechalav . he shows us from the Gemeara that Rav ashi woould hold accordingto Rabbi Akiva that issur bassr bechalave derabbanan is assur bebshul miderabbana and assur behana'ah. Although the Rambam and the maggid Mishnah rule otherwese, and the ccepted p'sak is otherwise, therevcan be no doubt if Rav Ashi is the operative sugya the Bach is right. <br>
<br>The Be'er Hagolah cites the Bartenura as supporting the Rambam's read. But a simple peak at the Bartenura inside supports Rav Ashi'as read IOW the Bach. <br><br>Question: do I have to be a bigger gadol than the be'er Hagolah to read the Bartenura's OWN WORDS and see tht he does NOT agree wtih Rambam et. al? What's agdlus go to do with it?<br>
<br>Now the Bac hTRIES to fit Rav Ashi into the Rambam's OWN words. Why is the Bach WRONG on this 2nd part? Simple not only does EVERYONE read the Rambam the other way, but the Rambam on peirush Mishnayos is EXPLICITLY the other way! <br>
<br>Are you NOW going to tell me that since the BACH is greater than RRW, that RRW cannot read the Rambam better - given thR ambamm's own words on the matter. Gadlus is irrelevant!<br><br>Furthermore since we paksen like Rambam maggid Mishn et. al. then Rav Ashi's read of Rabbi Akiva is irrelevant! </div>
</div><br>or if you will mah nafshach<br>either the vast array of Rishonim over-turn Rav Ashi nd the simple read of the Gmara<br>OR<br>the Bach [as da'as yachid to be sure} overturns the vast array of Rishonim<br><br>
Or Tosafos saying the mishna re: Dancing on YT is no opted [nullified} Does that make Tosafos a bigger GAODL than Rab Yehudah hasnassi uveis dino?<br><br>Or the Brikse shita re: TEcheils IS me'akve es halvan despite a Mishna to the contrary. { a problem we used to wrestle with in yeshiva]<br>
<br>My Problem with RMF's rejection of the BY's evara to defend Tosafos is not tht RMF lacks the RIGTH to disagree with BY. it's the lack of any argument to the fact.<br><br>Gadlus is only relevant re: opinions. Gadlus is irrelevant when you have FACTS. <br>
So if 999 gedolim say electricity is halachically like fire that is an OPINION and cannot be over-ridden by lesser people.<br><br>But if a Gadol miscontrues a source and runs with a bad read, who says you cannot make a tiyuvta! The latest amoraim did Tirvuta's on the earliest generatations by bringin in FACTS in the form of Braissos! That does nto mean that the authros orf the Talmud [let's say Mar bar rav Ashi for the sake of illlustration] was GREATER than Rabbi Yochanan! [see Arveiepsachim for example.<br>
<br>Shluggin up is a function of bringin in sources. Meisevei's and Esisevais' are bringin in HIGHER sources that trum pthe gadlus of the individual<br><br>When Bach reads Rambam as following his shita, I trump Bach wioth the Ramban's own words! it;'s not the ego of RRW tht wins, it is the SOURCES that trump the Bach. [FWIW the Shach iirc makes this point ,too!]<br>
<br>And if we were consistent, we would follow Rav Ashi/Bach over the Rambam but we do not. And that itself is a cause for further debate. I'm not sure why the BRA who uses Talmudic text to trump Halachic precedent does not jump on this one,but then again I have no see nit in a while so maybe he does.<br>
<br>Bottom line, if you can muster a higher sources, gadlus does not count. This can be shown in dozens if not 100's of times in the Talmud itself and certainly in nos'ei keilim on poskim. <br><br>QED <br>-- <br>
Kol Tuv / Best Regards,<br><a href="mailto:RabbiRichWolpoe@Gmail.com">RabbiRichWolpoe@Gmail.com</a><br>see: <a href="http://nishmablog.blogspot.com/">http://nishmablog.blogspot.com/</a>