<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Feb 7, 2008 7:32 PM, Zev Sero <<a href="mailto:zev@sero.name">zev@sero.name</a>> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
Micha Berger wrote:<br>> I just sent:<br>> : Gezeiros based on mistakes still stand. Their authority is not about<br>> : correctness, but of the legislative power of Sanhedrin.<br>></blockquote><div><br>See Tosafos on:<br>
Mayyim Acharonim<br>Dancing ON Shabbas<br>andsee IM Orach Chayyyim pt. 2 #100 on the above Tosafos <br><br> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
<br>> Since the post to which I replied was posted, the subject of chalav<br>> yisrael butter came up. The same question: pesaq vs gezeirah with<br>> included explanation, unexplained gezeira, arises here too. For that<br>
> matter, permitting chalav hacompanies requires believing it was one of<br>> the first two categories, and thus the gezeira wouldn't apply to USDA<br>> milk.<br><br>Not so. As RMF explains it, the gezeira is in full force, and doesn't<br>
depend on a high likelihood of actual adulteration. In fact, it assumes<br>that the likelihood is *not* high,....<font color="#888888">Zev Sero </font></blockquote><div><br>My understanidng of the 1st teshuva is different:<br>
<br>The Gemara explictly states that a Jew need not watch - he just has to be present and ABLE to watch. So if while a Jew is sitting in a position that he he cannot see it the chalav is STILL OK so long as he CAN see when he stands up... This is due to the dynamic of mirsas. RMF takes this Mirsas dyanamic and says the same is true for the USDA that IT creatres the same Mirsas. Thus the gezeiras is in full effect, but the USDA is merely a proxy for Jew who is not lookiing but ABLE to see if he chooses. <br>
<br>Ergo, In countries or locales that have no mirsas factor haeliv akum is still every bit as unkosher as it has been since the time of the Talmud. <br><font color="#888888"><a href="http://lists.aishdas.org/listinfo.cgi/avodah-aishdas.org" target="_blank"></a></font></div>
</div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br>Kol Tuv / Best Regards,<br><a href="mailto:RabbiRichWolpoe@Gmail.com">RabbiRichWolpoe@Gmail.com</a><br>see: <a href="http://nishmablog.blogspot.com/">http://nishmablog.blogspot.com/</a>