[Avodah] normative standard

[Akiva Miller]

.
R' Joel Rich asked:

> Do you have an underlying approach as to when chazal used some
> kind of  normative standard and said that we ignore individual
> deviation (batla dato) such as kviat seudah and when they said
> we must look at that specific individual's' specifics such as
> maaleh lugmav? (also many non-food applications

Just to clarify, the starting point of this question seems to be that for
"kviat seudah" (by which I presume you mean the point at which Pas Habaa
B'Kisnin gets Hamotzi and Birkas Hamazon) is the same for everyone,
everywhere, regardless of the individual's personal appetite and practices
etc.

That is certainly how I always remembered this halacha. As the Mechaber
168:6 writes: <<< PHBK is Mezonos and Al Hamichya. If one eats so much that
other people are kovea, then even if he is not kovea on it, it still gets
Hamotzi and Birkas Hamazon. ... And if he eats a [smaller] amount, which
others are not kovea upon, then even if he *is* kovea, it is still only
Mezonos and Al Hamichya, because "batla daato". >>>

But I recently saw a Beur Halacha which fine-tunes this somewhat. It seems
that the halacha here is NOT "batla daato etzel KOL adam" ("this individual
is batel to the average human"), but rather, "this individual is batel to
other people who are like him". Here are his words, Beur Halacha 186 ,"Af
Al Pi Shehu Kovea": <<< ... Nevertheless, it seems clear that if he is a
zaken or a naar, who naturally eats only a little, then he is *chayav* in
Hamotzi and Birkas Hamazon if they ate the amount that *they* are always
kovea upon, because everyone OF THEIR MIN suffices with that sort of shiur.
>>>

I can personally confirm what he writes about small appetites among the
elderly. I'll still say mezonos on one single slice of PLAIN pizza, but
about a year ago I found myself unable to finish an entire slice of
eggplant pizza, and ever since that day (based partially on this Beur
Halacha and partially on how I've heard Rav Asher Weiss paskening about
pizza in general), I say Hamotzi even on a single slice of pizza if it has
any extra toppings at all.

Akiva Miller

PS: Here's a three-minute video where Rav Asher Weiss explains his opinion
that Kevias Seudah depends not only on the amount, but also on the manner
of eating. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=icwAtAaUIK8

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