[Avodah] The 13 middos

Micha Berger micha at aishdas.org
Mon Dec 4 14:29:08 PST 2017


On Sun, Dec 03, 2017 at 11:13:00AM +0200, Marty Bluke via Avodah wrote:
: The Gemara in Shavuos (4b) discusses who the Tanna of the Mishna is and
: brings down a fundamental machlokes tannaim about the 13 middos. R'
: Yishmael darshens klal uprat and R' Akiva darshens ribuy umiut. The
: Acharonim point out that these are mutually exclusive and every Tanna
: darshens one or the other but they cannot be mixed (e.g. a Tanna sometimes
: darshens ribuy umiut and sometimes klal uprat). ...

I do not understand this paranthetic comment, as it refers to a kind of
mixture, a tanna who uses both styles of derashah, as an example of how
they cannot be mixed. The willingness of the two batei midrash to use the
others' methodology is stated outright on Bekhoros 51a.

One such tanna is R' Aqiva himself, eg Yerushalmi Sotah 8:1 (vilna 34a).

See RSRH's discussion in Collected Writings V pg 170.

: something so fundamental as the 13 middos be a matter of dispute? Weren't
: the 13 middos given to Moshe at Har Sinai? How could they forget such a
: basic thing? ...

The methodology could have been in use informally before Hillel started
the meta-Torah of the study and formalization of rules to describe that
methodology.

Just as people can use proper grammar before anyone makes a formal study
of the language's grammatical rules.

Since each did use the others' rules, the formalized rule system doesn't
actually define the list of inherited laws.

Tir'u baTov!
-Micha

-- 
Micha Berger             None of us will leave this place alive.
micha at aishdas.org        All that is left to us is
http://www.aishdas.org   to be as human as possible while we are here.
Fax: (270) 514-1507            - Anonymous MD, while a Nazi prisoner


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