[Avodah] Brewing coffee on Shabbos

Akiva Miller via Avodah avodah at lists.aishdas.org
Thu Nov 17 18:30:15 PST 2016


R' Michael Poppers wrote:

> In Avodah V34n150, R'Micha responded to R'Akiva re the
> French press. Just to clarify RAH's position, published in
> the previous digest, he forbade the French press on Shabbos
> because it's a k'li, even though one is still obtaining
> ochel mitoch p'soles.

Several people have expressed this view, that the French press is ochel
mitoch p'soles. I do not understand this at all. When one pushes down on
the filter, that pushes the leaves down to the bottom of the k'li, away
from the clear liquid at the top of the k'li. Isn't this a clear and simple
case of p'soles mitoch ochel?

Similarly, R' Isaac Balbin linked to
https://pitputim.me/2011/05/18/plunger-coffee-on-shabbos who wrote:

> Consider two distinct stages in the birth of the final coffee
> product. The first is when the stem is pushed down into the
> glass press, thereby forcing the ground coffee to the bottom
> of the glass. What act is being performed during this stage.
> In my opinion, this is an act of diversion/casting aside. The
> coffee is moved down to the bottom, but at no time does has
> it become separated from the coffee liquid above. For there
> to be an act of borer, I understand that the undesirable needs
> to be removed from the desirable. I would argue that it has
> not been removed, but has been forced into a new section of
> the glass environment.

I don't follow this logic at all. If the p'soles "has been forced into a
new section of the glass environment", then it most certainly has been
removed!

He says that "The coffee is moved down to the bottom, but at no time does
has it become separated from the coffee liquid above." At no time? That's
exactly what happens when the grounds are pushed to the bottom, isn't it?

Perhaps people are hung up on the idea that one is *pushing* the p'soles
away. Do they think that borer is violated only when one brings the p'soles
close to oneself? If that were so, there would be very simple solutions to
most situations. (Don't like peas mixed in with your carrots? No problem -
just push them away! I don't think so.)

I don't understand what these people are saying. I am open to new ideas.
What point am I missing?

Akiva Miller
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