[Avodah] A quantum of time

[Akiva Miller via Avodah]

R' Micha Berger wrote:

> I think tokh kedei dibbur works because it's a quantum of time.
> Any two statements made within that span is close enough to
> simultaneous as to make no difference.

That's possible, but I think that a much simpler explanation is that Chazal
established Tokh Kedei Dibbur (hereafter TKD) as the shiur for "Did he
change his mind?" In other words, if one corrected his words fast enough,
we presume it to be an uninterrupted flow of thoughts, and the second
speech is a automatic correction kicking in. But if the delay was longer
than TKD, then there is room to question what's happening, because he may
have changed his mind in the interim.

I think this makes a *lot* of sense in the context of testimony in court.
But I think that it might apply even in a case where one corrected himself
in davening ("HaKel HaKado--- HaMelech HaKadosh"). The immediate correction
might be seen On High as a plea to ignore the first speech, because the
second one is what he had intended to say.

> Now, if someone greets their rebbe at the respectful speed of a
> mere 3 syllables per second, then the 10 syllables of "Shalom
> eilekha rebbe umori" would take approximately 3-1/3 sec, or 1
> cheileq. And I suggest that this one indeed the intent, because
> a cheileq is the quantum of time when it comes to computing the
> calendar.
>
> The two uses of time are quite different, so the quanta needn't
> be equal. But it would be elegant if tokh kedei dibbur was a
> way to estimate out a cheileq, that both did indeed describe
> the same unit.

It would indeed be elegant. I have vague memories of a sefer that defined
the length of a TKD as a certain fraction of a mil. Unfortunately I do not
remember what it said nor which sefer it was. (In contrast, it is trivial
to calculate a Kedei Hiluch Daled Amos, as it is exactly 1/500 of a mil.)

I am intrigued by this notion of a halachic quantum of time. I would like
to offer another argument in favor of this, which I think is even stronger
than RMB's example. And then I will argue that TKD is *not* a halachic
quantum of time.

Pro:

Mishne Brura 55:4 -- "The Halachos Ketanos 48 writes that when two or three
people are saying kaddish together and one precedes the other, if they each
come within a TKD, then one may respond Amen with the first or with the
last, and it counts for them all. But if there is a pause, he should answer
to each one."

I would have expected the halacha to tell us that we should answer the last
Kaddish, and that the Amen would count even for the first, because, after
all, the Amen was said less than a TKD after the first Kaddish. But that's
*not* what the MB says; he says that one may respond in between the two.
Imagine that! One may answer Amen *before* the second Kaddish, and it
counts!

Apparently, his logic is that the two Kaddishes are viewed as simultaneous,
because only where the two Kaddishes are separated by a TKD does he concede
the existence of a "pause" - or, in his words, a "hefsek".

Con:

I begin by reminding the chevre that there's a machlokes whether a TKD is
the time it takes to say the 7 syllables "shalom alecha rebbe", or the 10
syllables "shalom alecha rebbe umori". But either way, it's much longer
than it takes to say an average word.

In OC 128:8, the Mechaber that one should not say an Amen Chatufa, which is
"one should not cut it off, and rush to answer before the blesser completes
it." Mishne Brurah 124:30 explains more fully: "One should wait until the
Shatz totally completes every last word. There are some people who begin to
answer while the Shatz is still standing in the last half-word, and this is
assur."

Please note that in most cases, this "last half-word" is much shorter than
a TKD. It seems that even if a TKD is a quantum of time (=simultaneous) for
Kaddish, it is not so for brachos.

This MB reminds of a riddle from when I grew up, in the era before sushi
and General Cho's chicken:

Q: What's the bracha on Chinese food?
A: (sung with great chazzanus) Hamevarech Es Amo Yisrael Ba-Chowmein.

Akiva Miller
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