[Avodah] Chayav livsumei

[Micha Berger via Avodah]

On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 04:51:46PM +0200, Lisa Liel wrote:
: On 3/21/2016 4:19 PM, Micha Berger via Avodah wrote:
: >I think RSN's question is based on the word "michayav"...            If
: >there is nothing to be yotzei, why do they use the shoresh "chayav"? OTOH,
: >if it is an actual chiyuv, why "michayav" rather than the usual (and
: >shorter) conjugation, "chayav" itself?

: Perhaps the line should be read bit'mihah.  "Is one chayav to drink
: on Purim...?"  It would explain why it's immediately followed with
: what can only be a cautionary tale *again* overdrinking.

While this answers the question you quote, it would make my tangential
question stronger. If no in the gemara actually speaks about a chiyuv
(or "chiyuv") to drink ad delo yada, why would it become the dominant
opinion in the rishonim (with the exception being some Provencial
rabbanim) and broadly accepted practice? I asked why follow Rava rather
than what appears to be the gemara's maqanah, but if that's not even
what Rava meant... I would therefore conclude that it's generally not
taken bitmiha.

Tir'u baTov!
-Micha

-- 
Micha Berger             A cheerful disposition is an inestimable treasure.
micha at aishdas.org        It preserves health, promotes convalescence,
http://www.aishdas.org   and helps us cope with adversity.
Fax: (270) 514-1507         - R' SR Hirsch, "From the Wisdom of Mishlei"