[Avodah] zilzul shabbat

[Micha Berger via Avodah]

On Wed, May 27, 2015 at 10:25:26AM +0300, Eli Turkel via Avodah wrote:
:> I think the problem is more than just avoiding the issur, but making
:> it trivial to entirely avoid it.
: 
: In that case how about a "dud shemesh" according to the poskim that it is
: allowed because it uses the sun

I don't know. Maybe because you still can't boil hot water if you wanted
it, say, for your tea.

:> The textbook case would be on Shabbos 6a: situating someone in a meqom
:> petur so that someone in a reshus hayachid can hand items to them so
:> that they could then hand it over to someone in a reshus harabim.
:> Rashi ad loc explains "demezalzel be'isurei Shabbos".>>

: would there be a difference between doing this once and making this a
: standard procedure?

Good question. I don't see "standard procedure" in the gemara, it looks
like a one-off.

It depends if we're talking about zilzul of kevod Shabbos, or zilzul
of the melakhah, the latter being more of a "threat of slippery slope"
problem. Rashi has "mezalzel be'isurei Shabbos".

BH 337:2 "shelo yishtaberu" uses the same turn of phrase.

Why would you be afraid of cheapening the issur if we aren't talking
about that opening the door to future violation?

The Tur OC 315, Beiur Halakah 344 and elsewhere talk about not doing
things "shelo yavo'u lezalzel bo". Which clearly invokes a slippery
slope argument; but not that zilzul is itself a slippery slope, rather
than zilzul is such a problem, we avoid things that will slide us there.

Tir'u baTov!
-Micha

-- 
Micha Berger             It is harder to eat the day before Yom Kippur
micha at aishdas.org        with the proper intent than to fast on Yom
http://www.aishdas.org   Kippur with that intent.
Fax: (270) 514-1507                       - Rav Yisrael Salanter