[Avodah] Why Not: Yehoshua BEN Nun?

[hankman]

On 13/06/2012 12:55 PM, hankman wrote:
> I am not much of a mequbal so it is safe to say I have never heard of this idea of ?progressive revelation.? If I intuit the meaning correctly then I have a major problem with this concept. Based on the hashkafot I was taught, this idea would be heretical grade A. Torah was revealed to man but once at Sinai. At any later time any claim for a new or additional revelation is false and any person making such a claim is per force, even if he is a known navi, a navi sheker and to be punished as such. This seems to me to be squarely at odds with the idea of progressive revelation. Whereas ?Torah lo bashomayim hi? fits neatly with the hashkofot as I was taught, progressive revelation does not. What am I missing here?

RZS responded:
Then what is nevuah? "Vezot Hatorah" means no new *halachot* can
be given. But secrets of Torah can be revealed. After all, "Torah
chadasha me'iti tetzei".

CM responds:
First in case there are any with the misconception that there is a pasuk in Yesheiahu (51:4) that reads "Torah chadasha me'iti tetzei" they should know that no such pasuk exists. (I know, RZS never said it was a pasuk). The pasuk actually reads: "Torah me'iti tetzei." The word “chadasha” is an interpolation of the medrash. 

I did a couple of searches on this phrase and it turns out that for the most part so far as I can tell this question has been repeatedly asked wrt this concept of “Torah chadasha” as well. (This phrase appears most often in the writings [based solely on my several computer searches] of Lubavitchers). But the reference time frame is almost always “l’osid lavo” or “yemos hamoshiach” etc. but not bezmaneinu. Our discussion was the nekudos as we know them today. Also we could call that the hilchos pronounciation for our time, so this IS “halachot.” As far as “secrets” of Torah being revealed, they generally assume this refers to a more in depth understanding of ta’amei hamitzvot. Some also use this concept to explain the change  in ruling like Beis Shammai l’osid lavo, as he was more in tune with the higher meaning of the mitzvot while Beis Hillel was more firmly planted on terra firma.

I also googled “progressive revelation” and the large majority of the hits were either Christian or Bahai web sites.

Finally, “nevuah” is firmly rooted in commands of the Torah, and is not to be seen as an attempt to add HV”S to the Torah. It is a command to believe and obey the commands of a navi – not to create a Torah chadasha. They can only be of a temporary nature and not a new mitzvo ledoros (unless of course it is as takonos) and valid even if they temporarily countermand an express command of the Torah – but clearly based on the Torah as given miSinai.

Kol Tuv

Chaim Manaster

 

 
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