[Avodah] Yom Tov Sheni for Olim LeReget to the Beit

[Micha Berger]

This thread began, typo in subject line and all in Nov '09. I revived it
last June when I got to Y-mi Eiruvin 3:9, top of vilna 26b), in which we
learn that some "seder mo'ados" was available in R' Yosi's day. Meaning a
calendar (if not the current one) must have been in use before R'
Hillel II. (Even according to those who disagree with R' Bachaye and R'
Chananel.)

The thread is at http://bit.ly/mtp2YM , the revival I'm mentioning is
the v28n91 post in that thread.

Someone else just pointed out to me that ANY mention of precomputed
calendar in the Y-mi has to predate R' Hillel II -- the text was closed
(aside from less intentional drift) by then.

But here's another bit of evidence... Y-mi Sukkah, end of 4:1, vilna 18a.

    R' Simon [a/k/a R' Shimon ben Pazzi] charged those who do the
    computations... Have in mind that you do not make neither teqi'asah
    [RH] on Shabbos, nor Arvasa [Hoshana Rabba] on Shabbos. And if you're
    stuck, make Teq'asah [on Shabbos] and do not make Arvasa.

R' Simon and R' Yosi are both third generation amora'im (turn of through
early 3rd cent CE), roughly contemporary.

So, in their day, people did preplan the calendar, but there was enough
leeway that these things were a decision. This still fits R' Bachaye
and R' Chananel, because it still means they planed RC and only used
eidim as part of the maaseh mitzvah of qiddush hachodesh. But it gives
an earliest possible date for the use of a fixed calendar, no?

It could be explained two ways, and I'm not sure the difference is all
that much:

1- There were guidelines, but the algorithm wasn't firm enough to force
their hand on when RH is. Somewhat computed, since there are times
you couldn't get both RH and HR to be on a day other than Shabbos,
but not entirely.

2- There was an algorithm, but the ilin demashchevin had the authority
to refine the algorithm.


The question is what is the "seder mo'ados" that R' Yosi speaks of?
Was it that people were preplaning moados far enough ahead to mail the
Alexandrians of a while in advance?

Abayei veRava were 4th gen. Meaning just after the time in question, the
calendar was steady enough for Abayei to talk about YT sheini shel goliyos
being minhag avos. Same question about "seder moados" -- it's possible
YT sheini became a derabbanan rather than a real safeiq deOraisa due to
precomputation and mail, not due to fixing the calendar permanently.

And R' Hillel II, who the tradition says was pre-meqadeish the months,
was 5th. (Which doesn't mean he invented the current calendar, just that
he enabled qiddush without eidim coming to the Sanhedrin.)

It seems that with the exception of a lack of clarity of one dechiyah rule
which wasn't decided until R' Saadia Gaon's day, our calendar was very
around the era of Abayei veRava, give or take at most a decade or two.

Tir'u baTov!
-Micha

-- 
Micha Berger             It's nice to be smart,
micha at aishdas.org        but it's smarter to be nice.
http://www.aishdas.org                   - R' Lazer Brody
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