[Avodah] is this muttar?

[Zev Sero]

On 19/07/2011 5:51 PM, T613K at aol.com wrote:
>We are talking about using force [...]  to make someone do something
> that he doesn't want to do.  The "something" he doesn't want to do is
> free a captive -- his own former wife.
> You could definitely make a case that freeing a captive (the ex-wife)
> trumps dina demalchusa and doesn't need the authority of a king, or
> of anyone.  The only reason you'd need a bais din, or at least the
> approval of a very well-respected rav, in my understanding, is that
> under certain circumstances a get given under duress is not halachically
> valid, so you would need to know that after you had forced the man to
>  release his wife, she really was free.

On the contrary, a get given under duress is *always* invalid.  What a
person may be forced to do is obey a legitimate order of a Beis Din, no
matter what it is.  In this case, the order is to give a get.  When the
BD themselves are applying the force this distinction isn't so important,
because one implies the other.  But when the force is being applied by
goyim, then the distinction becomes crucial: the goyim must be careful
only to order him to obey the BD, and never to order him to give the get.
If they order him to give the get, then it is pasul.

-- 
Zev Sero        If they use these guns against us once, at that moment
zev at sero.name   the Oslo Accord will be annulled and the IDF will
                 return to all the places that have been given to them.
		                            - Yitzchak Rabin