[Avodah] Yom Tov Sheni for Olim LeReget to the Beit Mikdash

[Micha Berger]

On Mon, Jun 13, 2011 at 04:42:17PM +0300, Simon Montagu wrote:
: On Sun, Jun 12, 2011 at 11:13 PM, Hankman <salman at videotron.ca> wrote,
: quoting  Rabbi Moshe Bogomilsky
: http://www.sichosinenglish.org/books/vedibarta-bam/foreword.htm:
: > According to the Gemara (Shabbat 87b) the Jews left Egypt on Thursday.
: > Consequently, since the first Pesach was celebrated on Thursday, the
: > following Rosh Hashanah was on a Shabbat. Therefore the Torah does not
: > mention the actual sounding of the shofar but only "zichron
: > teruah" - "a remembrance of shofar blasts."

: > A difficulty that may be raised with the explanation is that the rule of
: > knowing from Pesach on what day of the week a given holiday will fall,
: > applies only nowadays when the new month is established al pi
: > hacheshbon...
...
: > An answer to this difficulty may be the following: Rabbeinu Bachya
: > (Shemot 12:2) writes in the name of Rabbeinu Channaneil that throughout the
: > forty years the Jews sojourned in the wilderness, the new month was in fact
: > established according to a pre-calculated system...

: Firstly, right there in Shabbat 87b, there is a mahloket, among other
: things, whether Iyyar was haser or male; in fact the whole sugya seems
: to presuppose the possibility that the calendar wasn't exactly the
: same as the current fixed calendar.

As I posted already, there is no reason to believe that the fixed
calendar of Hillel Nesi'ah was the one anyone is claiming was used
beforehand. In fact, we proved otherwise, since Rava fasts for 2 days
because he didn't know if Elul was made full (RH 21a, c.f. Or Samayach on
Qiddush haChodesh 5:3). The OS also brings raayos from the nasi wanting to
add an Adar (Sanhedrin 12a) and Abayei having a Fri 9 beAv (Taanis 29b).
And Abayei was niftar 5 years into Hillel's nesi'us!

If we take it for granted that the Sanhedrin would close its doors to
force re'iyah was in order to fit a given calendar algorithm, the choice
of algorithm was in flux in Abayei veRava's days. And yet Abayei also
says "minhag avoseihem beyadeihem" -- that YT sheini shel galiyos was
no longer necessary. It stopped being in flux in his day too.

IOW, there is a difference between saying they fit a computation and saying
that people would know in advance which computation they would choose to
fit.

Which brings us back to Shabboss 87b, being explained given the
presumption that the calendar in question was Hillel II's. For that
matter, isn't that compelled by the belief that the avos kept kol haTorah
kulah even "davar shetalmid asid lehischadeish..."? The avos used the
final pesaq on the calendar, but MRAH didn't???

: Secondly, we know from the Mishna in RH 4:1 that in the Mikdash they
: did blow the shofar on Shabbat. Why would they not blow the shofar in
: the Mishkan?

For that matter, it's a derabbanan not to blow shofar on Shabbos. The
din didn't exist yet regardless of which calendar was used or whether
the BHMQ's exemption -- which was based on the yir'ah one has even within
an anan-less bayis sheini -- applied to the Mishqan.

Which brings us back to how one understands that medrash.

Li nir'eh the whole thing has to do with the rules of midrashic stories.
They aren't historical claims, they are Torah ones. Stories repeated
without regard to historicity or any claims about whether they did or
didn't occur.

They therefore have to work according to the rules of those who repeated
the meshalim and melitzos. Otherwise the medrash fails to do what it was
told to do -- teach a religious truth. The tzadiqim have to be doing
the right thing by the rules in place by those telling the story, and
resha'im's actions have to fit how we view them -- also given those rules.

Tir'u baTov!
-Micha

-- 
Micha Berger             It isn't what you have, or who you are, or where
micha at aishdas.org        you are,  or what you are doing,  that makes you
http://www.aishdas.org   happy or unhappy. It's what you think about.
Fax: (270) 514-1507                        - Dale Carnegie