[Avodah] Ein Mevatlin issur lechatchilah

[Micha Berger]

On Sun, Jan 17, 2010 at 05:44:30PM -0800, martin brody wrote:
: It's not the European model. It's the laws of kashrut from the
: Gemara,Shulkan Aruch, Rishonim, Achronim and contemporary poskim. They
: followed those laws in Babylon, North Africa, India Northern Europe, Eastern
: Europe, Southern europe, Western Europe, everywhere in fact including, North
: America.......until about 30 years ago or less.

... EY also plays by the same rules as North America.

We should also note that when it comes to beer, whiskey, tea, and a
number of other established items, the rules did not get changed. It's
hard to picture the poseqim of today deciding that since beer is a term
of trade, we can rely on them not modifying the recipe to include tarfus
or stam yeinam (except WRT dark ales, where stam yeinam is an accepted
option in trade practice).

But in general, we made many more things efshar levareir by growing a
large kashrus industry. The question no longer is whether we had to;
but rather now that they are, can we really rely on the same rules of
birur as before?

Although I agree with RAM that the heter being used revolves around
whether one has to be chosheish for something that if present would be
bitul a"y nakhri, not a case where we know the bitul is occuring bevadai.
(Something I was hazy on when all this discussion began.)

Tir'u baTov!
-Micha

-- 
Micha Berger             Every second is a totally new world,
micha at aishdas.org        and no moment is like any other.
http://www.aishdas.org           - Rabbi Chaim Vital
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