[Avodah] Midrashim and Eilu V'eilu

Harvey Benton harveybenton at yahoo.com
Fri Jan 16 04:16:12 PST 2009


I apologize: my previous post on Midrashim contained a ref. to Shabbas 63b as the source for the dictum of Eilu V'eilu. I couldn't find it there; if someone knows the original source, please post.

Rashi on Kesuvos 57a describes some of the parameters for Eilu V'Eilu in historical contexts (versus for example machlokes in halacha).   There are several Aishdas postings on the this topic but none that I could find discussing for instance the differing opinions regarding some actual historical events or artifacts; including:  A. the different ways the shofar used to be blown in the Temple B. the shape of the Menorah in the BHamikdash C. the arrangement of the letters on the tzitz of the KGadol D. What exactly was in the Aron (e.g. jar of man, staff of Moshe) v. what was placed on the side of it; etc. 

Can we easily say that some of Chazal's opinions on mutually-exclusive historical events are wrong? Or would that be kefirah? (If we are forced to hold by Eilu V'Eilu in even these kinds of instances -- we might be forced as a possible explanation, to have to come up with some multi-dimensional multi-faceted universe, where differring physical metzuises can exist at the same time). 

One Aishdas Listing (vol 2, no.47) reads as follows:
Micha Berger writes:
>As already pointed out, eilu va'eilu doesn't work when the topic is history.
Not as simple as it may seem. See Pachad Yitzchok, Igros U'Ksovim, no. 30.
Yisrael Herczeg

Followed by (vol 2, no. 48):
Rav Hutner....
He does not deal with arguments of Chazal concerning
Metzius which are not directly related to halacha ie. what happened historically.
Thus Rashi's (Kesubos 56a)position that historical fact per se is not covered by eilu v'eilu is not contradicted by Rav Hutner.....
Daniel Eidensohn

If someone has access to the Pachad Yitzchak reference brought down by R. Yisrael Herczeg, and could post what it says regarding these issues, I would appreciate it.  If the members of Avodah feel this topic has been previously discussed sufficiently, I apologize for this post..... HB








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