[Avodah] proofs of G-d

[Yitzhak Grossman]

On Fri, 23 Nov 2007 12:52:17 -0500 (EST)
"Micha Berger" <micha at aishdas.org> wrote:

> My biggest problem is understanding how to define the difference
> between HP and teva. HQBH created both. The rishonim discuss a

[snip]

> With a modern understanding of how the world works, The only
> difference seems to be whether we attribute His decision to the
> individual case, or to a general rule set into motion nearly 6,000
> millenia ago. Did Hasehm decide on 9/11 to save this tzadiq and allow
> that one to perish, or did He create a world in which that would be
> the outcome if people chose to do what they did that morning? Hashem
> doesn't have a concept of time, so mitzido, it's the same decision no
> matter when we attribute it to. If we view it in terms of 6 millenia
> beforehand, we're saying that HQBH knew when He set up teva, that He
> was setting up a universe in which hu yichyeh, vehu yamus.

There's a major distinction even without reference to time.  Does God
care about individual incidents and the consequences of His laws for
individual entities, or does He care solely about the fate of His
creation in the aggregate, without being concerned about the fate of
particular creations?

> To put it another way... Is it defying HP when Hashem chooses to allow
> an evil person's bechirah delay another person's sechar va'onesh? Or
> to allow the bechirah possible through hester panim, and thus allow
> the expected natural event to occur? Aren't those too His deciding
> what should happen? When speaking of the Borei who set everything into
> motion, isn't His decision not to act the same thing as His decision
> to set things up so that that inaction would have a particular
> outcome? In which case, didn't the Aibishter really act, as part of
> the "set up"?

His decision to refrain from action in a specific case might indeed be
the same as action, given Divine Omniscience, but a decision to ignore
a large class of events or created entities and allow broad natural
principles to determine their fates without regard to any individual
distinctions between members of the class or entities would not be HP.

> SheTir'u baTov!
> -micha

Yitzhak
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