[Avodah] Skeptics

[Richard Wolpoe]

On Nov 14, 2007 4:01 AM, david guttmann <david.guttman at verizon.net> wrote:

> RRW writes ;
>
> >That is perhaps why the Kafich's "leidah es Hasehm" is supeior over
> "lehaamin..."  because knowing/experiencing is superior than either
> logical
> belief or even "blind belief."When one KNOWS that one is a parent or a
> spouse there is no need to "believe" taht one has a relatiosnhip!
> Similarly
> when one experiences God
> logic is unnecessary, rather one relates to God..
>
> RMB writes:
>
> >I find it very difficult to believe that that's the distinction R'
> el-Qafeh was making in insisting the Arabic should be translated as
> yedi'ah
> rather than emunah.
>
> I have to agree with RMB in this as far as Rambam's position. He clearly
> sees experience ONLY after philosophical attainments as he tells us in
> Yesodei Hatorah 4:12 Teshuvah 10:6 and other places.
> David Guttmann
>
>
RRW responds:
While  I concede that the Rambam was into philosophy etc. I think WADR you
are focusing on the tree and not the forest, the means and not the end

The Tachils  accocrding to Rambam  is "da'as es hashem"  [as in
Yirmeyahu  "hakseil vado'a osi"
Yeshaya: "D'aas es Hasehm kemyaim layam kechashin.
Shir Hashirim in toto, etc.

The Tachliss aisi is a form of GNOSIS. Philosophy is the Rambam's path.
Mysticism is  his son's path  in that he reportedly embraced some
"Suif-istic" values. But aisi Rambam and his son's goal remains the same.

If this concept has not been articulatedd before, then I would be surprised.
If so, then it represents a paradigm shift. People have pigeon-holed the
Rambam as a "mere" philosopher. He was much more than that, and this goes to
my points re: Rambam being a mystic [although not a Qabbalist].  The Moreh
was embraced by many as more of a mystical  text than a philosophic one.  in
fact, iirc Pines in his intro takes issue with classifying the Moreh as a
philosophical text at all.

Just because KNOWING  GOD includes mental/intellectual aspects does not mean
that is the GOAL the Matarah of KNOWING GOD. It is merely the intellectual
pre-requisite.


It is obvious to me that merely philosophizing that simply pedestrian
knowledge that "God is there" is NOT the point of the Rambam beyond an
elementary level.  That would be tantamount to saying that reading a bio of
one's spouse is KNOWLEDGE in terms of their relationship. Knowledge as used
by Torah and Rambam indicates to me a far more intimate relationship than
mere philosophy. The  GOAL of marriage is not the wedding. The GOAL is more
about attending the grandchildren's wedding.  Requiring a wedding to get
there does not mean that this is the final tachlis at all!

-- 
Kol Tuv / Best Regards,
RabbiRichWolpoe at Gmail.com
Please Visit:
http://nishmablog.blogspot.com/
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