[Avodah] women learning Torah

[Micha Berger]

On Tue, November 6, 2007 9:02 pm, T613K at aol.com wrote:
:> And so, Plato has Socrates prove that the real  unchanging Platonic
:> Truths are learned before birth, and "learning is  recollection".

: Given this context, I think the chiddush isn't that we're  prepared
: knowing Torah in order to make Torah learning easier. Rather,
: Chazal's point is that those Truths aren't limited to geometry or  the
: rigorously provable, but are/include Torah.<<

: I think this quoted dialogue has more to do with  math than with
: Torah.

My point exactly!

:          It has to do with the question of whether  mathematics is
: "discovered" or "invented"...

Plato assumes that math is Platonic Truth, not only discovered, but
more fundamental than the "real world", which is only shadows on the
cave wall compared to things like math.

Chazal turn his mashal on its head, implicitly saying that the
Platonic Truth is Torah. And thus Torah is discovered from truths the
soul has already been exposed to.

By knowing Plato's use of the mashal, you get a different picture
about Chazal's emphasis. Rather than being about Hashem doing us a
favor to help us in our learning, it becomes a variant on the theme of
"histakeil beOraisa ubarei alma", adding that since this is true, and
since we have existed outside of that olam, we have an innate
knowledge of the blueprint. (Which allows us to discover Torah rather
than learn it anew.)

SheTir'u baTov!
-micha

-- 
Micha Berger             One who kills his inclination is as though he
micha at aishdas.org        brought an offering. But to bring an offering,
http://www.aishdas.org   you must know where to slaughter and what
Fax: (270) 514-1507      parts to offer.        - R' Simcha Zissel Ziv