[Avodah] literalism

[Richard Wolpoe]

On 10/9/07, saul mashbaum <smash52 at netvision.net.il> wrote:
>
> The existence of non-literal *terms*, a common feature in any language,
>  does not justify the conclusion that the legal statements made by chazal
> may sometimes be taken non-literally (a position which nevertheless I
> believe to be correct).
>
> Saul Mashbaum
>
Correct it's all about semantics
but to me literal avoids the idiomatic

What you seem to be saying is that we should usually follow the P'shat.
What I am adding is that the literal meaning is not always the p'shat
becasue sometimes the p'shat is dealing with an idiom.

Illustration:
My point is a "piece of cake" literally en francais: un morceau de gateau.
Of course that would be a bad translation. Literally a piece of cake is
something you probably eat after making a mezonos. Idiomatically it mens
something simple
Re-translate the above idiomatically and you would say:
[something like:]
Ma point est tres facile [a comprendre]. My point is easy [to understand]

I discussed Targum Onkelos with Professor Moshe Bernstein. He mentioned that
the Targum does not always state the p'shat. After we chatted, it turns out
that he conceded that even the p'shat is not always the literal meaning -
due to of idioms, metaphors, similes, etc.  So while sometimes Targum is off
into Midrash [e.g. lo sevashel g'di]  at other times his non-literal
translation really IS the  simple pashut p'shat because the original is
after all idiomiatic.


Back to Hametz
Bodkim es hechametz
Literally: inspect the Hametz

> Idiomaticaly search FOR Hametz [m'chappsim be'ad hechametz]
>

But if one is overly rigid, dogmatic, or inflexible, idioms could be taken
literally too.
Hazal aisi were very  loose at times with expressions in  order to convey
various levels of meaning . And sometimes they  repeated verbatim legal
statements that stem from different eras of  linguistic history.  Think
about all the synonyms we have for kal vachomer!

Kol Tuv / Best Regards,
RabbiRichWolpoe at Gmail.com
Please Visit:
http://nishmablog.blogspot.com/
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.aishdas.org/pipermail/avodah-aishdas.org/attachments/20071009/10adfbe6/attachment-0002.htm>