[Avodah] Slogan game (was: Vehoyo einecho ro'oys es Morecho)

[Micha Berger]

On Tue, July 3, 2007 3:59 pm, mkopinsky at gmail.com wrote:
: On 7/3/07, Micha Berger <micha at aishdas.org> wrote:
:> Daas Torah

: Is this originally a quote from somewhere?  I thought it was a new
: term used for a new idea.

It is used in contrast to da'as nota in Chullin 90b. (I did say I was
seeding the list with Avodah perennials...) In the gemara, "da'as
Torah" means a pesaq compelled by the Torah, in contrast to a "da'as
nota", where the evidence only leans in favor of one pesaq over the
other.

It is not about "da'as Torah" as used today because (1) it's about
pesaq specifically, and (2) today's da'as Torah is actually a kind of
da'as nota -- statements that emerge from a Torah weltenschaung, not a
conclusion one must reach from the received sources.

Since I'm already threatening reopening that can of worms, here's my
blog entry on it
<http://www.aishdas.org/asp/2004/11/todays-daas-torah.shtml>.

I believe the idea evolved from RYSalanter's. RYS is the earliest
source for the idiom in modern times that I'm aware of. However, when
you strip his idea of its Mussar context and underpinnings, it
perforce evolves into something else. I do not believe RYS expected
people to turn to a rav for anything beyond pesaq and mussar advice
(the latter being where DT really launched from) and he didn't speak
of a black-and-white separation between gedolim who have DT and the
hamon am who do not. Rather, it was something we each should be trying
to build within ourselves. But see the blog entry.

Tir'u baTov!
-mi

-- 
Micha Berger             Spirituality is like a bird: if you tighten
micha at aishdas.org        your grip on it, it chokes; slacken your grip,
http://www.aishdas.org   and it flies away.
Fax: (270) 514-1507                            - Rav Yisrael Salanter