[Avodah] Required beliefs

[Micha Berger]

On Thu, July 12, 2007 11:49 am, Rich, Joel wrote:
: 	Are there any opinions out there who take issue with the
: Rambam's requirement that to be a "full fledged" ben noach you must
: not only carry out the 7 mitzvot but do so because you believe HKB"H
: gave Moshe the Torah...

Actually, the Rambam (Melakhim 8:11) only discusses two possibilities
-- someone who keeps them because they were reaffirmed by Moshe at
Sinai, and someone who keeps them because they are logically
compelling. (Who isn't a ger toshav [regardless of passing other
requirements] nor chasidei umos ha'alom, but is a chakham.)

I therefore do not know what he would say about someone who keeps them
because of the berisim of Adam and Noach but not believe in Torah
miSinai. Besides, while such a belief system is possible, how likely
is it that someone believes in a historical Adam or Noach with whom
Hashem made a beris, but not ma'amud har Sinai?

>From <http://www.jlaw.com/Articles/noach2.html>, footnote 53:
> Rabbi Yosef Engel, Beit Otzar Marechet 1-1: '7, 9. "The seven Noachide
> commandments are still obligatory to Jews, and their authority derives
> from their pre-Sinai obligation. The Torah... merely added to
> Noachide laws..."

This footnote is on an interesting statement of the Meshekh Chokhmah
that a child who is a bar da'as WRT the 7 mitzvos must keep them,
since legabai the 7 mitzvos, there is no din of bar mitzvah -- it
begins with comprehension. And the Seridei Eish speaks of Noachide
Marriage when a couple wedded in a manner pasul for a Jewish one.

The subject relates also to the connection between when they were
given, where in the Torah they're recorded, and the nature of the
chiyuv. See footnote 28.

Tir'u baTov!
-mi

-- 
Micha Berger             Spirituality is like a bird: if you tighten
micha at aishdas.org        your grip on it, it chokes; slacken your grip,
http://www.aishdas.org   and it flies away.
Fax: (270) 514-1507                            - Rav Yisrael Salanter