[Avodah] Selichos - especially before midnight

[Arie Folger]

RDKay wrote:
> I think R. Wolpoe's arguments raise the larger question of what weight
> should be given to kabbalistic practices.  It seems to me some of these
> practices have become so enmeshed in our custom and sifrei poskim that ARE
> halacha and cannot be dismissed, except perhaps by those Teimanim who never
> adopted these practices to start with.  No-one, for instance, rejects
> practices prescribed by the Talmud on the basis that could only have had a
> mystical rationale.

Bime'hilat kevod Toratkha, I see two conflated issues. Kabbalah is not the sum 
total of Jewish mysticism. Die hard Ari-only-fans will equate the two. 
However, there are many other mystical strains, some of which have known a 
continuous tradition, while others are discontinuous.

For example: our version of kabbalat Shabbat does not accord with the Ari, as 
we do not go out in the fields, but rather is according to Rav Moshe 
Cordovero plus the addition of five more mizmorim, a minhag of unclear 
origins. (I couldn't back up RY'E's contention that this is from RaMaK, too. 
The contrary seems the case.) Likewise, extended tashlikh is mostly according 
to RaMaK. Minhag Ashkenaz has preserved some ideas dating on prayer from at 
least 'Hassidei Ashkenaz, though these ideas aren't easily understood. 
Nonetheless, that is one important reason why some kabbalistically inspired 
prayerbook reforms (-> "nussa'h Sefard") were not accepted.

Cognoscenti see in the Moreh Nevukhim a mystical system, too (in the third 
part). Tanakh specialists see mystical practices there. We cannot even 
approach understanding certain mitzvot without assuming nonrational (but not 
antirational), mystical ideas.

Obviously, many mystical concepts predate the Ari and many predate what most 
people would call kabbalah, i.e. Zohar, Bahir etc., especially for those who 
accept RY'E late dating of the Zohar.

Hence, the mere non-acceptance of kabbalistic ideas in public worship does not 
mean the lack of mystical influences.
-- 
Arie Folger
http://www.ariefolger.googlepages.com