[Avodah] Charedim and the army?

[Doron Beckerman]

JR -Interesting that this type of supposition/argument in other cases is
dismissed by a simple, they were at that level, we're not.

DB - Of course Kodesh Kodoshim should be assumed to be judged subjectively
by the times. Otherwise the Rambam may as well be completely obsolete,
beacuse there is no way to judge it. RMF may have counted as a Poshut Yid
back then, but that doesn't mean he isn't Kodesh Kodoshim now. And the least
of Leviim back then might be the greatest Gadol HaDor 500 years ago, but it
is hard to think that he would look himself in the mirror, compare himself
to everyone else, and say, 'I am sanctum sanctorum' as RAL proposes the bar
ought to be.

JR -  In any event the shevet based exemption could be simply understood as
a practical and role model approach ( do we really need as many kohanim
as the descendants of Aaron?)
DB - The point is not need for a particular job, the point is the
correctness of application of an exemption which in theory is based on
achievement.



JR - what does the netziv understand as to their activities in non-wartime?
Were they all absentee landlords? Does anyone else take this approach?

DB - What's the difference? You haven't addressed the main point which is
that the Netziv is an open contradiction to the need of every single
exemption being based on looking oneself in the mirror and having some
over-inflated ego.

 JR -" with no concern for the Cheshbonos of Bnei Adam " When I originally
learned this Rambam I was taught this meant that they did not do so because
they got stipends or were even aware of them.

DB - These people aren't learning so they can get stipends, they are getting
stipends so  they can learn. (Any reference to Shitas HaRambam vis-a-vis
getting money while learning is, according to RMF, Atzas Yetzer Hara, and
has no place in this discussion. One simply cannot hope to be Muchtar
B'Kesser Torah and hold like that Rambam today, as per RMF, and to say that
one loses Kodesh Kodoshim status today because he receives money to subsist
on while learning, is, IMHO, vaiter Atzas Yetzer Hara.)

 JR -imho this is apples and oranges - would you group someone who never
married with someone who deferred pirya vrivya due to learning or other
extenuating circumstances?

DB - First of all, well over 50 percent of Charedim do eventully do some
kind of army service. Secondly, what does that have to do with the exemption
of Shevet Levi? If it applies to Mercaz HaRav at age 18, then it applies to
a Charedi at age 35. And, BTW,  if someone is deferring Pirya VRivya for
learning, i.e. relying on Ben Azzai, then of course  the same Ain Yityzro
Misgaber Alav and Nafsho Chashkah BaTorah would apply to a 45 year old just
as it did to Ben Azzai who never married.
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.aishdas.org/pipermail/avodah-aishdas.org/attachments/20070801/a9aa7cff/attachment.htm>