[Avodah] Peshat (was Re: Rav Keller's JO article on evolution )

[Micha Berger]

On Sun, November 5, 2006 11:30 pm, R Zvi Lampel wrote:
: RMB:
: Which would include idiomatic or poetic usage, or even rare but accepted
: usage.

: ZL:
: Yes, if there is some reason to abandon the literal meaning, which indeed is
: often, maybe even usually, the case....

: RMB:
: IMHO, this doesn't touch the inyan of whether "yom" must mean day rather than
: era unless we are told.
:
: ZL:
: It follows from the above that "yom" means day, rather than era. That's how
: people talk presently. That's how you must agree it is usually used in the
: rest of Tanach....

A phrase or word could be meant literally, idiomatically or allegorically.
Peshat includes idiom; no one would assume translating "charon apo" as "his
anger" is non-peshat. And so, idiomatic expressions are basically the same as
less common translations.

As RZL wrote above, we assume by default the more common translation, but do
not need a mesorah to fall back on the less common one -- if one is compelled
to do so.

This isn't the same as reinterpretation through allegorization, as this is
simply doubt resolution -- assume the meaning follows rov until you have more
data. (For that matter, from RSRH's stance, words don't carry two meanings,
they carry a fundamental meaning that might differ widely by context. One is
conjecturing about the missing context, not bucking existing mesorah.)

But here we plausibly have that more data! Once you say you allow rare or
idiomatic translations where needed, someone can assert one wherever they need
it.

...
: ZL:
: Any "peshat" meaning is valid, but the definition of valid "peshat" is what's
: at issue. If the most usual usage is not given priority, then you are simply
: disregarding, or disagreeing with, what RSG, Rambam and Sefer Ikarrim are
: trying to tell you, or rendering their thesis meaningless.

Well, as RSG gives it, it's very narrow. The rule would only apply when
deciding between options. If you find one option impossible, then one can
assume the problem is the choice of translation.

Tir'u baTov!
-mi

-- 
Micha Berger             Spirituality is like a bird: if you tighten
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