[Avodah] Asara B'Tevet

[Micha Berger via Avodah]

On Mon, Dec 28, 2015 at 08:45:32PM -0500, Zev Sero via Avodah wrote:
: What geonim?   I don't believe any geonim mention this idea.
: As I wrote earlier, AFAIK it's the Abudraham's own chiddush.
: The "gezera shava" from Yechezkel is not a source at all; one can't
: make up ones own gezeros shavos, and there doesn't seem to be any
: source for this one...

It can't be a real gezeirah shavah. First, because Yechezqeil is neither
chumash nor Esther, so it cannot be darshened. And second, because 10
beTeves is derabbanan, so it wouldn't be subject to nor need a real
gezeirah shavah.

However, it is a reasonable implication. There real derashah for fasting
for Yom Kippur on Shabbos is from the words "be'etzem hayom hazeh".
Then you have Yechezqeil using the same phrase to describe 10 beTeves.
He must have known what it sounded like when he echoed the idiom.

BTW, beris milah too is "be'etzem hayom hazah" and overrides Shabbos.

: so it's just a fun idea to bat around; if it were halacha lemaaseh
: the Abudraham would probably never have proposed it in the first place,
: and if he had it would have immediately been dismissed out of hand by
: everyone else.

But if it were just "fun", the Beis Yoseif (OC 550) wouldn't quote the
Avudraham. This is after quoting Rashi and the Rambam, who say all 4
fasts would be pushed off until Sunday. And right before saying that he
does not know the Avudraham's source.

So I think we're overplaying the import on both sides. More thn
a fun idea to bat around, but not the accepted shitah of the more
famous rishonim, and questioned by the author of the SA.

Tir'u baTov!
-Micha

-- 
Micha Berger             Between stimulus & response, there is a space.
micha at aishdas.org        In that space is our power to choose our
http://www.aishdas.org   response. In our response lies our growth
Fax: (270) 514-1507      and our freedom. - Victor Frankl, (MSfM)