[Avodah] ethics outside of halacha

[Eli Turkel]

> Ramban's Naval Bershus haTorah, that one can keep all the mitzvot and still
> be evil, does not imply there is a definition of evil not formally stated in SA.
> Firstly, is Naval the same as Evil? Perhaps it only means not nice,
> unpleasant, perhaps even ugly.

> We are certainly bound to repent for bad Midos as per RMBM Hilchos Teshuvah.
> Does that not make midos part of Halacha? Such a Naval is certain to face BD
> Shel MaAlah. Bershus HaTorah perhaps means using a v narrow view but
> ignoring more subtle aspects of Halacha.

Granted that naval means not nice etc by definition it does not mean
someone who has committed an averah.

I have no problem that middot are part of halacha many are certainly
listed in the Rambam. The question is what defines what are good or
bad middot. Some are mentioned explicitly in various halachic sources
however much is what society at large considers good midot - what I
would call being a mensch.

Perhaps the title of ethics outside of halacha was not accurate
enough. The meaning is not that these things do not count in bet din
shel maalah but rather that the source of these behaviors is not from
any explicit halacha but rather from "natural law" or as R Chiya would
express it learning from animals.


[Email #2. -micha]

The discussion of ethics outside of halacha reminds me of a problem I
have and stories I read about gedolim

I once read about the CC (with the usual disclaimer that we dont know if
the stories are true) that late at night some poor boy had the job of
cleaning the floors in the bet medrash He would ask the last remaining
chavruta to move while he cleaned that section. The story goes that
CC remarked that the cleaner would pay in Gan Eden for disturbing the
learning of the talmidim. I have read stories also with the opposite
message.

In fact in one chavruta I have at night it is on the time that the cleaner
mops the floor and we always have to move around him. If we dont move
either our places dont get mopped or we demand that the cleaner stay
around until we finish learning neither of which seems fair

-- 
Eli Turkel