[Avodah] Waiting to Daven Maariv on Shavuous

[rabbirichwolpoe at gmail.com]

Chana:
> It is somewhat ironic to me, that the Sephardi poskim do indeed go on
> about the tircha d'zibbura involved in waiting, and how it diminishes
> simchas yom tov, and they generally lived in places where the wait was
> not so bad, whereas in Ashkenaz, where you can be talking about nearly
> 11pm at night before you can make Kiddush, the minhag arose.

Well Chana not only are their splits bet Ashkenaz and Sepharad, but also
within Ashkenaz, too!

EG AFAIK, Yekkes do not daven ma'ariv late by Shavuos. The litmus test
for MOST Western Ashkenazim are minhaggim of Maharil, Rema, and sometimes
Levush (and the other usual suspects!)

Also note that GRA and SA harav have an earlier tzeis than does Rabbeinu
Tam. So waiting for their tzeis is not as onerous.

FWIW I was at Queens Jewish Center circa 1985 for Shavuos

Nusach ashkenaz davened regular YT time

Nusach Sepharad had the late "tzeis" minyan

My shul in the Heights. [Consisting of elderly] we davened the usual
7:10-7:15 pm. If I had a large congregation I would also have an early
minyan and a late minyan as a matter of policy. Why should elderly be
forced to daven late?

---------------
R Shlomoh Pick
> let's not forget that most mainstream rishonim and posekim hold that
> keriyat shma should be recited after tzeis.

True! Yet Magen Avraham warns people to repeat shema after tzeis because
of lack of KS al hamitta - This clearly implies several points, that:

1 they davened before Tzeis
2. Everyone stayed up all night

I don't mind davening late per se myself, but it is a tircha for many
and especially for zkeinim as mentioned above.

-RRW
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