[Avodah] Are Upsherin and Bonfires Taken from the Gentiles?

[Mandel, Seth]

You may post in my name.

Well, funny you should mention that.  I did not, because I do not 
have the time to enter into a full discussion of this 
matter.  Suffice it to say that "negel vasser" as currently practiced 
is not an old Jewish custom.  N'tilas yodayim before davening in the 
morning is.  And it is called n'tilas yodayim.  But that has nothing 
to do with one's fingernails.  The latter was an innovation in Europe 
according to the Zohar and kabbolo.  Look in the Tur and SA: n'tilas 
yodayim is onely done once in the morning, after going to the 
bathroom and before davening.
There will be many cries that what I said is not correct.  There are 
g'moros that have been reinterpreted as referring to negel 
vasser.  But they were not interpreted that way by the 
rishonim.  This matter needs a long discussion to make clear the 
changes that have taken place, probably even a longer discussion than 
I wrote for bonfires, Lag ba'Omer and opsheren.  But I do not have 
the time now, and am not sure when I will.  However, do not take my 
silence as consent.
Weddings are called by all chasunes.  Funerals are called levayas, 
even though their is nothing wrong with the English  word (or the 
German word) in either case.  The only other thing that comes to my 
mind right now not in Hebrew is a "vort" for an engagement 
party.  But that was also a European innovation to replace 
tenoim.  Vort refers to the signed agreement made between the 
families of the choson and kallo, which, however, was significantly 
different than what was signed in tenoim.  Tenoim, AFAIK, is only 
done today by certain chasidic groups that cling fast to their old 
customs; yeshivishe circles changed it already in Europe because of 
halachic concerns (innovation again).



-----Original Message-----
From: T613K at aol.com [<mailto:T613K at aol.com>mailto:T613K at aol.com]
Sent: Sun 5/17/2009 12:42 PM
To: avodah at lists.aishdas.org; Larry.Levine at stevens.edu; Mandel, Seth
Subject: Re:  Are Upsherin and Bonfires Taken from the Gentiles?

From: Yitzchok Levine _Larry.Levine at stevens.edu_
(<mailto:Larry.Levine at stevens.edu>mailto:Larry.Levine at stevens.edu)

Quoting  R' Seth Mandel:
 >>  For a linguist, the importance of
the ceremony being  called "halaqe" (Arabic for "shaving, haircut")
also cannot be  overemphasized.  As most people are aware, Jews have
always used Hebrew  words for old Jewish minhogim, even if there was a
suitable term in the  spoken language (e.g. Shabbos rather than
Sabbath, or bris rather than  circumcision), because the Hebrew term
carried with it the connotations of  the Jewish dinim and minhogim
associated with it.  Arabic (and  Germanic/Yiddish) were only used for
customs that did not have a Jewish  background (e.g. shtreimel or
yarmulke or farbrengen). <<


 >>>>>>

What about negel vasser?



--Toby  Katz
=========








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