[Avodah] 15 different fruits on Tu B'shvat

[Micha Berger]

On Mon, January 7, 2008 10:19 pm, Liron Kopinsky wrote:
[RMM:]
:>  It reminds me of Rav Hirsch's visiting the Alps so
:> that he'd be able to answer Hashem in the affirmative when asked
:> about seeing His wonders.

: This touches on an idea I've been having some trouble with.
: Mesillat Yesharim, Chapter on Perishut
: Even though it says
: ' (Yerushalmi Kiddushin 4:12) a man will have to give an accounting to
: the Presence for everything that his eyes beheld and he did not wish
: to eat, though permitted and able to do so....
: the Ramchal still says that it is proper to abstain as much as
: possible from all worldly pleasures:
: ' The undesirable type of separation is that of the foolish gentiles
: who abstain not only from that which is not essential to them, but
: also from that which is, punishing their bodies with strange forms of
: affliction that God has no desire for....

: This seems to suggest that the level of Perushut we should be striving
: for is basically abstain from anything not absolutely necessary.

I think the MY gives a definition outright which conflicts with your
deduction. In the third sentence or so (taken from
<http://www.shechem.org/torah/mesyesh/13.htm>, translation by R' Aryeh
Kaplan):
> The rationale of Separation is epitomized in the words of our Sages
> of blessed memory (Yevamoth 20a), "Sanctify yourself through what is
> permitted to you." This is the signification of the word "separation"
> itself i.e. separating and withdrawing oneself from something,
> forbidding to oneself something which is permitted. The intent is to
> keep oneself from that which is forbidden, the understanding being
> that a person should withdraw and separate himself from anything which
> might give rise to something that could bring about evil, even though
> it does not bring it about at the moment and even though it is not
> evil in itself.

Perishus is avoiding challenges that one might not successfully pass
that which "could bring about evil". Which explains the Ramchal's
progression in the text that follows the above:
> If you look into the matter you will perceive three distinct levels
> - the forbidden things themselves, their fences (the edicts and
> safeguards that our Sages of blessed memory made binding on all of
> Israel), and the "withdrawals" that those committed to Separation
> must create for themselves by circumscribing themselves and building
> fences for themselves; that is, by abstaining from things which were
> permitted, which were not proscribed to all of Israel, and separating
> themselves from them so as to be far removed from evil.

Perishus is non-binding non-national, but an extension of the same
idea as gezeiros.

Similarly in the next pereq, where the Ramchal divides perishus into
perishus behana'os, perishus bedinim and perishus beminhagim (in the
sense of conduct, not tradition, as this is described as hibodedus and
shetiqah). This is perishus bedinim:
> It has already been indicated that those who practice Separation may
> not guide themselves by what is permitted to all of Israel, but must
> withdraw themselves from what is repulsive, from what is similar to
> it, and from what is similar to what is similar to it.

So far so good. The only problem with the above is the MY's discussion
of perishus behana'os:
> Separation in relation to pleasures, which we spoke of in the previous
> chapter, consists in one's taking from the world only what is
> essential to him. This type of Separation encompasses anything which
> provides pleasure to any one of the senses, whether the pleasure be
> gained through food, cohabitation, clothing, strolls, conversation or
> similar means, exceptions obtaining only at such times when deriving
> pleasure through these means is a mitzvah.

Whereas the Ramchal in pereq 13 talks about the mutar being fine as
long as is doesn't lead to aveirah, in pereq 14 he is saying the mutar
is to be avoided unless it leads to mitzvah. The text RLK cites is
compatible with either tzad.

And in 15, he explicitly says he is talking about both:
> THE BEST WAY for a man to acquire Separation is to regard the
> inferior quality of the pleasures of this world, both in point of
> their own insignificance and in point of the great evils to which
> they are prone to give rise.

Both positions are pretty well documented in other sources. I would
suggest that the kasuv hashelishi is the continuation in pereq 15:
> For what inclines one's nature to these pleasures to the extent that
> he requires so much strength and scheming to separate himself from
> them is the gullibility of the eyes, their tendency to be deceived
> by good and pleasing superficial appearances...

I would suggest the Ramchal's two elements are perishus from that
which leads to sin, and perishus from addiction -- "ad sheyatzrikh kol
kach vetachbulos lehafrisho meihem".

SheTir'u baTov!
-micha

-- 
Micha Berger             One who kills his inclination is as though he
micha at aishdas.org        brought an offering. But to bring an offering,
http://www.aishdas.org   you must know where to slaughter and what
Fax: (270) 514-1507      parts to offer.        - R' Simcha Zissel Ziv