[Avodah] Cave or desert island

[Micha Berger]

On Fri, Feb 08, 2008 at 01:24:48PM +0200, Michael Makovi wrote:
: I think we might have some confusion between a national-only brit and
: a -nation-as-a-collection-of-individuals brit.

: I'm not saying the brit is national only; if it were so, then only the
: melech and the kohanim would have mitzvot, and the individuals would
: just be there to do who knows what.

I meant national only in contrast to the notion of two berisim. One in
Shemos, between Hashem and *each* Jew, and one in Devarim between Hashem
and the Jewish People as a coporate entity.

IOW, not only do we need to build a society of perfected individuals,
but each person needs to aspire for a higher goal than benei Noach to be
individuals serving our common mission.

We are not only a holy nation, but each individual alone can be a kohein
to the world.

: Rather, the brit is of the nation as a collection of individuals. This
: is to say, the purpose of the Torah is not to perfect the individual,
: but rather to create a society of perfected individuals.

I would still consider this a beris with the nation.

...
: I am thus puzzled why say that were the brit only nation, it'd mean
: that in chutz a person ought to drop the 613. Rather, it seems to me,
: if the brit were individual, then he ought to drop the 613; davka the
: brit being national is why he keeps the 613 even in chutz.

Although your clarification of "a society of perfected individuals"
does explain the overwhelming number of baalei machshavah who explain
mitzvos in terms of their effect on the individual. I do not see
resolutions to my other questions:

Since there is a beris with the individual, his fulfilment of that beris
will be redemptive no matter where he is. If the beris is with the nation,
then his fulfilment depends on his participation in nationhood. You
associated that with the Jewish people, and by mixing the Sifra into
this, with the Jewish people in EY in particular. The individual alone
on a Carribean island is not partipating in the "society of perfected
individuals", so how does his observance help fulfill the goals of
the beris?

You also did not address my lemaaseh questions: about how a practice
qidushin or practice get have any chalos usable in Israel, or why they
would permit violations of non-practice observance of beris Noach?

Gut Voch!
-Micha

-- 
Micha Berger             "I hear, then I forget; I see, then I remember;
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